Raiders sign Morgan Smithies on three year deal from 2024

[Matt]

We seem to have problems in closing out the deal….

Sanders -> to be confirmed
Weekes -> to be confirmed
Smithies -> to be confirmed

We only have Sasagi confirmed.

Happy to be corrected.

DT said Weekes was confirmed in the Fog article. But club hasn't yet

[Kermit]

Fox Sports also reporting today Weekes is ‘expected to sign’
https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... e6733f3412


Maybe waiting for November 1?

[LimeGreenMachine]

We should chase Deardon

[Postman Pat]

We should chase Deardon

Agreed, had would be a great piece to the puzzle.

[Botman]

I think the plan for halves is pretty set now
It's Strange and Sanders, with Fog acting as the hold over... so i dont think we're in the market for a guy like Deardon

And we'll succeed or fail on the back of those players and our ability to provide them an environment to have them flourish

[Azza]

I think the plan for halves is pretty set now
It's Strange and Sanders, with Fog acting as the hold over... so i dont think we're in the market for a guy like Deardon

And we'll succeed or fail on the back of those players and our ability to provide them an environment to have them flurish

I mean it's exactly not a good omen that you didn't even spell 'flourish' correctly, is it?

[Botman]

I think the plan for halves is pretty set now
It's Strange and Sanders, with Fog acting as the hold over... so i dont think we're in the market for a guy like Deardon

And we'll succeed or fail on the back of those players and our ability to provide them an environment to have them flurish

I mean it's exactly not a good omen that you didn't even spell 'flourish' correctly, is it?

I dont think my stupidity has a prophetic element to it but if it does its far from ideal!

[Bluesbrother]

Seems like another Bateman style player with what he could bring with his work rate and aggressive nature. We need a mongrel in our team who doesn't take rubbish. I love an English forward. Smithies doesn't seem to be the exact positional player but he does sound like a winner.

I do wonder what this means for a Trey Mooney. Cowboys looking for a prop. We're looking for a strike backrower. Would we trade Mooney for a Cowboys gun backrower?

[RedRaider]

Mooney was playing prop in NSW Cup. I would be hanging on to Trey. His playing style and build reminds me of a young JFH. Not the biggest player on the park, but gets the job done.

Smithies to provide the defensive sting in what I hope will be an off season defensive structure overhaul. Imo we need to turn ourselves first of all into a top 4 defensive side, as we also look to improve our attack. We cannot have more than 600 points put on us in a season and expect to be competitive with the best sides.

The Panthers were easily the best defensive side in the NRL. It starts with their fitness levels. They are swarming the entire game. The wingers stay out on their opposite number confident that the defensive line is always in motion to snuff out threats. They hit in numbers to drive opposition players backwards to kill momentum. They smother opposition sides. To only have 312 points scored against them in a full season, is a testament to their prowess.

[MrPosh]

Seems like another Bateman style player with what he could bring with his work rate and aggressive nature. We need a mongrel in our team who doesn't take rubbish. I love an English forward. Smithies doesn't seem to be the exact positional player but he does sound like a winner.

I do wonder what this means for a Trey Mooney. Cowboys looking for a prop. We're looking for a strike backrower. Would we trade Mooney for a Cowboys gun backrower?

This is where Papa is the bait to snare a top back-rower. Make it a swap for the ages.

Anyway, you guys have Smithies covered.

I said a few days ago, he's a very straightforward player and a very tough and good defender.

It puts the Raiders back to a defensive lock - personally I love a ballplayer and Puru looks great - but he's a very good version of that.

And the key is, if you can't upgrade the most needed areas, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try to upgrade the others.

The Storm have always been great at letting go top players and effectively replacing them.

[Rickmando]

Seems like another Bateman style player with what he could bring with his work rate and aggressive nature. We need a mongrel in our team who doesn't take rubbish. I love an English forward. Smithies doesn't seem to be the exact positional player but he does sound like a winner.

I do wonder what this means for a Trey Mooney. Cowboys looking for a prop. We're looking for a strike backrower. Would we trade Mooney for a Cowboys gun backrower?

This is where Papa is the bait to snare a top back-rower. Make it a swap for the ages.

Anyway, you guys have Smithies covered.

I said a few days ago, he's a very straightforward player and a very tough and good defender.

It puts the Raiders back to a defensive lock - personally I love a ballplayer and Puru looks great - but he's a very good version of that.

And the key is, if you can't upgrade the most needed areas, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try to upgrade the others.

The Storm have always been great at letting go top players and effectively replacing them.

I agree, but your last statement is where the the problem lies when talking all things football management at the Raiders. We don’t compare favourably to the Storm in any way. The way they run their organisation vs the way we run ours is night and day!

Half a dozen of our veterans would have had the tap on the shoulder in the past 24 months if we were playing for the Storm. But we haven’t done that out of “loyalty to good blokes/those who bleed the most verdant of greens” - and for that we get stuck in the current situation we are in.

[Andymachine]

This is where Papa is the bait to snare a top back-rower. Make it a swap for the ages.

Anyway, you guys have Smithies covered.

I said a few days ago, he's a very straightforward player and a very tough and good defender.

It puts the Raiders back to a defensive lock - personally I love a ballplayer and Puru looks great - but he's a very good version of that.

And the key is, if you can't upgrade the most needed areas, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try to upgrade the others.

The Storm have always been great at letting go top players and effectively replacing them.

Is this an upgrade though? Defence is one area we need to improve but another major issue is our dour, unimaginative attack which could get better with a lock like Puru but could become even worse now with no Wighton and a tacklebot at 13.

I don't think many of us were all that excited about Bateman joining in 2019 but he turned out great (for that year) and I'm hoping this guy can do something similar. From what I'm reading about him so far in this forum though, I'm not very enthused. It doesn't sound as though this kind of player is what we need, and Puru and Mooney are 2 guys who could fill that role who we really should be giving opportunities to.

[Raiders_Pat]

On Papalii, he's still ahead of Guler and Saulo imo and if Horsburgh moves into the front row I think he could make a solid contribution to our team as a 30 minute impact player off the bench. That type of role would suit him perfectly at his age. Problem is we're probably paying him too much to be an impact guy.

As far as moving him on, seeing as he's on contract it would have to be something he would agree to... and he seems quite settled with his family in Canberra so I don't think there are too many options there besides his hometown of Brisbane. Broncos are reportedly considering moving Carrigan to the front row which I think would be a mistake. But I think that's pretty much the only option for us, although it could work if we're willing to take on some of his contract which we would be able to do with our cap space. Should be explored as an option at least, particularly considering they have second row options stuck behind players who could get a opportunity with us.

[Raiders_Pat]

And for the record, I'd be dead against the above if it meant we get Capewell. It would have to be Piakura or maybe Riki.

[BJ]

And for the record, I'd be dead against the above if it meant we get Capewell. It would have to be Piakura or maybe Riki.

Capewell is a defensive liability. Piakura is an idiot who is on the improve as a player however.

[Bluesbrother]

Seems like another Bateman style player with what he could bring with his work rate and aggressive nature. We need a mongrel in our team who doesn't take rubbish. I love an English forward. Smithies doesn't seem to be the exact positional player but he does sound like a winner.

I do wonder what this means for a Trey Mooney. Cowboys looking for a prop. We're looking for a strike backrower. Would we trade Mooney for a Cowboys gun backrower?

This is where Papa is the bait to snare a top back-rower. Make it a swap for the ages.

Anyway, you guys have Smithies covered.

I said a few days ago, he's a very straightforward player and a very tough and good defender.

It puts the Raiders back to a defensive lock - personally I love a ballplayer and Puru looks great - but he's a very good version of that.

And the key is, if you can't upgrade the most needed areas, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try to upgrade the others.

The Storm have always been great at letting go top players and effectively replacing them.

I agree, but your last statement is where the the problem lies when talking all things football management at the Raiders. We don’t compare favourably to the Storm in any way. The way they run their organisation vs the way we run ours is night and day!

Half a dozen of our veterans would have had the tap on the shoulder in the past 24 months if we were playing for the Storm. But we haven’t done that out of “loyalty to good blokes/those who bleed the most verdant of greens” - and for that we get stuck in the current situation we are in.

Who are you talking about? Who needs the tap? Croker has retired. EW and Rapana are being phased out but still contributing for us. Who else?

Papalii is still capable of elite football. He showed that this many times this year. On his day I wouldn't want any other front rower in the comp. He is elite with and without the ball. Josh Papalii is one of the best forwards of his generation and he is still performing for us. Those suggesting a Papalii swap are kidding themselves.

[PNGRaider37]

I'd rather have a 1/2 a Josh Papalii than 2 ex bronchoke back rowers

[Matt]

This is where Papa is the bait to snare a top back-rower. Make it a swap for the ages.

Anyway, you guys have Smithies covered.

I said a few days ago, he's a very straightforward player and a very tough and good defender.

It puts the Raiders back to a defensive lock - personally I love a ballplayer and Puru looks great - but he's a very good version of that.

And the key is, if you can't upgrade the most needed areas, it doesn't mean you shouldn't try to upgrade the others.

The Storm have always been great at letting go top players and effectively replacing them.

Is this an upgrade though? Defence is one area we need to improve but another major issue is our dour, unimaginative attack which could get better with a lock like Puru but could become even worse now with no Wighton and a tacklebot at 13.

I don't think many of us were all that excited about Bateman joining in 2019 but he turned out great (for that year) and I'm hoping this guy can do something similar. From what I'm reading about him so far in this forum though, I'm not very enthused. It doesn't sound as though this kind of player is what we need, and Puru and Mooney are 2 guys who could fill that role who we really should be giving opportunities to.

Since when?!? Bateman an English rep edge backrower who only won. I dont remember anyone being upset or un-excited.

I agree RE Smithies though. I don't see the need.

[Raiders_Pat]

Is this an upgrade though? Defence is one area we need to improve but another major issue is our dour, unimaginative attack which could get better with a lock like Puru but could become even worse now with no Wighton and a tacklebot at 13.

I don't think many of us were all that excited about Bateman joining in 2019 but he turned out great (for that year) and I'm hoping this guy can do something similar. From what I'm reading about him so far in this forum though, I'm not very enthused. It doesn't sound as though this kind of player is what we need, and Puru and Mooney are 2 guys who could fill that role who we really should be giving opportunities to.

Since when?!? Bateman an English rep edge backrower who only won. I dont remember anyone being upset or un-excited.

I agree RE Smithies though. I don't see the need.

Actually when we signed Bateman the comments were pretty much the exact same as what we're getting now with Smithies. Papalii was still playing in the second row if I recall correctly, plus we had Whitehead as the other second rower. People were basically saying they don't see the need when we've already got two top level edge forwards in the side.

[Raiders_Pat]

And I think Tapine may have been the other guy that was being put forward as an edge option at the time.

[Raiders_Pat]

Who are you talking about? Who needs the tap? Croker has retired. EW and Rapana are being phased out but still contributing for us. Who else?

Papalii is still capable of elite football. He showed that this many times this year. On his day I wouldn't want any other front rower in the comp. He is elite with and without the ball. Josh Papalii is one of the best forwards of his generation and he is still performing for us. Those suggesting a Papalii swap are kidding themselves.

It's the offseason lmfao these discussions are purely hypothetical. When you're offering up a player to trade with another club, you need to put up quality if you want a quality asset in return. Cowboys for instance aren't going to trade one of their gun edge forwards for Guler/Saulo/Hola. Papalii is a genuine asset that many clubs could use, that's the whole point of the discussion. Whether he would be interested in going to another club however, I wouldn't be betting on it... although I don't know the guy so I have no clue really.

He's been my favourite player for many years. However, our roster is currently way too heavily stacked with middle forwards and somebody is probably going to have to go. We wouldn't want to lose Horsburgh, Mariota, Mooney or Puru who all have promising upwards trajectories, so that leaves Papalii, Guler, Saulo or Hola when it comes to these discussions... and Papalii is the only one of them that could get us a high quality asset in return if we're speculating on trade scenarios.

[Raidernation]

Smithies is an 80min player at lock so clarifies a few things.
1. Hors to front row
2. Not looking for a 9 that can play 13 so Puru drops down the depth chart,
3. CHN is a second row option only
4. Mooney, guler, saulo, CHN are playing for 1 spot on the bench.

[Seiffert82]

Aggressive young defender who has seemingly played plenty of games in the second row.

He's only 22 years old, so highlights from 4 years ago don't tell me much.

With the squad we have I expect the second row is totally in the equation. Question is whether he has an offload in him.

[Bluesbrother]

I hear Smithies has been brought in to take some of Whitehead's minutes. Not sure how that looks but Whitehead definitely set for a reduction in minutes in 2024 and CHN also having big question marks over his future.

I'm also not sure we need to copy other teams. A lot of teams have a ball playing lock but it doesn't mean it's a necessity. It's really a team by team proposition. We need more creativity in attack but 13 doesn't have to be where it comes from.

Smithies sounds to me like he has plenty of ability as it is along with the attributes we need in that he works hard, competes and has experience winning. At 22, he is a good bet.

We can't stop here though. We need some creativity and tackle breaking ability. I personally don't care where those players play on the field just that we get them. Bateman was a unicorn for us. Early EW was top shelf with ball playing and creativity. Hodgson was Cameron Smith like at times. BJ Leilua could score a try from nowhere. All not your traditional creative positions but they created a lot for us. We need someone - or two like that. Keep the recruitment going.

[PNGRaider37]

I hear Smithies has been brought in to take some of Whitehead's minutes. Not sure how that looks but Whitehead definitely set for a reduction in minutes in 2024 and CHN also having big question marks over his future.

I'm also not sure we need to copy other teams. A lot of teams have a ball playing lock but it doesn't mean it's a necessity. It's really a team by team proposition. We need more creativity in attack but 13 doesn't have to be where it comes from.

Smithies sounds to me like he has plenty of ability as it is along with the attributes we need in that he works hard, competes and has experience winning. At 22, he is a good bet.

We can't stop here though. We need some creativity and tackle breaking ability. I personally don't care where those players play on the field just that we get them. Bateman was a unicorn for us. Early EW was top shelf with ball playing and creativity. Hodgson was Cameron Smith like at times. BJ Leilua could score a try from nowhere. All not your traditional creative positions but they created a lot for us. We need someone - or two like that. Keep the recruitment going.

Most sensible take I've read

[FROG]

If he is making 60 tackles a game surely that's a bunch less that others make, which means others are less fatigued and better able to create something in attack.

[Raiders_Pat]

I hear Smithies has been brought in to take some of Whitehead's minutes. Not sure how that looks but Whitehead definitely set for a reduction in minutes in 2024 and CHN also having big question marks over his future.

If that's true then I'm glad. I'm hoping we run with something like:
8. Tapine
9. Woolford
10. Horsburgh
11. Young
12. Smithies
13. Puru

14. Whitehead
15. Papalii
16. Mariota
17. Mooney

I reckon that sort of set up looks better than anything that includes Guler or Saulo for starters. If we can get the rotations/minutes right with the above, I think we can at least be a top defensive side plus it would improve our attack to run a one two punch with Woolford and Puru for at least that opening 20-30 mins. I'd have Whitehead on 20-30 mins into the game with Smithies to move to lock.

Just as an example, you could have the first three rotations of Woolford, Tapine and Horsburgh off, Whitehead, Papalii and Mariota on. Then the next four - Puru, Papalii, Mariota and Smithies off, Woolford, Tapine, Horsburgh and Mooney on, with one interchange up our sleeve as Ricky likes to have.

You could also have a similar lineup with Puru to start at 9, Mooney at 13, Woolford at 14.

[Bluesbrother]

I hear Smithies has been brought in to take some of Whitehead's minutes. Not sure how that looks but Whitehead definitely set for a reduction in minutes in 2024 and CHN also having big question marks over his future.

If that's true then I'm glad. I'm hoping we run with something like:
8. Tapine
9. Woolford
10. Horsburgh
11. Young
12. Smithies
13. Puru

14. Whitehead
15. Papalii
16. Mariota
17. Mooney

I reckon that sort of set up looks better than anything that includes Guler or Saulo for starters. If we can get the rotations/minutes right with the above, I think we can at least be a top defensive side plus it would improve our attack to run a one two punch with Woolford and Puru for at least that opening 20-30 mins. I'd have Whitehead on 20-30 mins into the game with Smithies to move to lock.

Just as an example, you could have the first three rotations of Woolford, Tapine and Horsburgh off, Whitehead, Papalii and Mariota on. Then the next four - Puru, Papalii, Mariota and Smithies off, Woolford, Tapine, Horsburgh and Mooney on, with one interchange up our sleeve as Ricky likes to have.

You could also have a similar lineup with Puru to start at 9, Mooney at 13, Woolford at 14.

I quite like that idea, I'm just not sure it will happen.

What's clear already though is we have a lot of competition for spots - across the board. I can't remember an offseason where there were so many close calls across the 17. Hopefully that means the players perform and are hungry.

[MrPosh]

There are at least a dozen better second rows that Smithies in Super League.

Probably only two better loose forwards, though.

[FROG]

There are at least a dozen better second rows that Smithies in Super League.

Probably only two better loose forwards, though.

Presumably that means you think he should be playing in the middle? I was reading an earlier post you wrote when Bateman first returned home. You commented that we should ask for this lad in return. Is it the case that he's lived up to your expectations, or are there flaws in his game such that you now have concerns with how this will play out?

I personally don't have a major problem with a hard running, hard tackling lock/loose forward. We obviously still have a major need for a quality edge though. Appears as though this dude may not be the answer to that problem which I guess is fine provided we have someone else lined up.

[Ruben Daley]

I hear Smithies has been brought in to take some of Whitehead's minutes. Not sure how that looks but Whitehead definitely set for a reduction in minutes in 2024 and CHN also having big question marks over his future.

If that's true then I'm glad. I'm hoping we run with something like:
8. Tapine
9. Woolford
10. Horsburgh
11. Young
12. Smithies
13. Puru

14. Whitehead
15. Papalii
16. Mariota
17. Mooney

I reckon that sort of set up looks better than anything that includes Guler or Saulo for starters. If we can get the rotations/minutes right with the above, I think we can at least be a top defensive side plus it would improve our attack to run a one two punch with Woolford and Puru for at least that opening 20-30 mins. I'd have Whitehead on 20-30 mins into the game with Smithies to move to lock.

Just as an example, you could have the first three rotations of Woolford, Tapine and Horsburgh off, Whitehead, Papalii and Mariota on. Then the next four - Puru, Papalii, Mariota and Smithies off, Woolford, Tapine, Horsburgh and Mooney on, with one interchange up our sleeve as Ricky likes to have.

You could also have a similar lineup with Puru to start at 9, Mooney at 13, Woolford at 14.

I like this though I'd expect Puru to start on the bench with Horse at 13 and Ata in the front row, so we have bigger bodies on early to absorb the initial softening up period and bring Puru on later to ballplay. That's the usual Ricky method and has merit with this combination of players, I reckon.

Regardless, those ten names represent our best combination of talent and versatility. Though, ideally, we'd sign a genuine 12 to allow Smithies to play lock.

[Bluesbrother]

I think Mooney could spend some time on an edge for us next year. Seems as though his future is in the middle but he does have some dynamic ability that could follow a Tapine style progression. I watched some highlights of Mooney yesterday - he has a lot to offer. Some have suggested his defence might not be up to it but I hope he has a big off season and works on that. Even the try he scored in the semi final shows what brute strength he has. Between he and Horse I think they can cover some time in the backrow in 24 to allow Ata to and Guler to remain in the 17.

I'm not sure about Saulo but he seems to have a place in the 17. I hope that changes next year or we might lose one of these young guns.

[Botman]

No might about it, guys like Mooney and Ata wont stick around to play NSW Cup when they're getting into 22-23 yo range.

If they dont get their opportunities here, they'll find them elsewhere... given where Stuart has very publicly said he's taking our squad, Mooney needs to be prioritised in terms of FG opportunities.

From what Stuart has said we're about to turn this squad over in a big youth movement. Mooney has potential to be a 10 year Papalii/Tapine level foundational piece to build a forward pack around. Can not be serious about a youth movement and be giving 25 year old solid footballers FG minutes over 21 year olds with that sort of upside.

[Raidernation]

No might about it, guys like Mooney and Ata wont stick around to play NSW Cup when they're getting into 22-23 yo range.

If they dont get their opportunities here, they'll find them elsewhere... given where Stuart has very publicly said he's taking our squad, Mooney needs to be prioritised in terms of FG opportunities.

From what Stuart has said we're about to turn this squad over in a big youth movement. Mooney has potential to be a 10 year Papalii/Tapine level foundational piece to build a forward pack around. Can not be serious about a youth movement and be giving 25 year old solid footballers FG minutes over 21 year olds with that sort of upside.

They clearly like Ata so it's surprising if he wasn't in the side. I'm don't think they are convinced with Mooney just yet. I think he has actually played very well in the 2 reasonable opportunities he has been given and deserves to be right there with the other guys fighting for a bench spot. I have a nagging suspicion he might be a little soft but tbh it's just a suspicion.
At the end of the day it looks like everyone will get a chance to prove themselves as there are many spots up for grabs. It's up to these players to take it and they shouldn't be given it because they are young and have 'potential'.

[Raiders_Pat]

No might about it, guys like Mooney and Ata wont stick around to play NSW Cup when they're getting into 22-23 yo range.

If they dont get their opportunities here, they'll find them elsewhere... given where Stuart has very publicly said he's taking our squad, Mooney needs to be prioritised in terms of FG opportunities.

From what Stuart has said we're about to turn this squad over in a big youth movement. Mooney has potential to be a 10 year Papalii/Tapine level foundational piece to build a forward pack around. Can not be serious about a youth movement and be giving 25 year old solid footballers FG minutes over 21 year olds with that sort of upside.

Between Papalii, Tapine, Whitehead, Horsburgh, Young (him and Horsburgh both 26 next season) and Woolford (27) there are plenty of older heads there to include the younger forwards in our 17. In fact, if you take the two grand final teams from 2023, the pack I named would still have an average age older than the Broncos and nearly right on par with the Panthers (only slightly younger).