Canberra Raiders miss out on David Fifita

[Dylan’s Raiders]

We need that killer blow which is what we are lacking - hopefully Chevy and Strange will be that (I’m confident they will) but we need to give them time. Also, if the raiders ever get a chance of signing Fifita, you take it.

Look at where our (increased) salary cap is going the next few years, it’s all youth and our highest earning players have left and are leaving. We have a really good squad, if we can sign any elite player bar a wing, prop, lock or centre then we need to do it.

The biggest name players we’ve signed in the last 8 years are probably Sezer, CHN and Dave Taylor

[greeneyed]

I can not imagine watching David Fifita play and thinking "na, im good. I dont want that player"
Tonight, in a badly beaten team, in a terrible team... his impact on the game was felt. If he wanted to be here, we'd be **** fools to think we're too good for him and that we dont need or want him. We've got a **** hot forward pack, it's very good. He'd be the best player in the pack instantly. And you can argue that with a wall, i'm not interested.

If he becomes available again, i think we'll be interested and make serious offers and we should. But i dont expect that to be the case. He re-signed there for reasons that are his own and i dont think a tough start to the year changes much about that decision

He doesn’t want to be in Canberra. He’s told us that twice. How many more times does he have to tell us? If he were to change his mind, fine. But he’s definitely a hot and cold player. I suspect Stuart told him he needs a much harder edge, more consistency, and if he came to Canberra, Stuart could help him develop, as he has with a lot of forwards. But no, David said, no not interested, twice. And money wasn’t the issue either by the looks.

[Botman]

I can not imagine watching David Fifita play and thinking "na, im good. I dont want that player"
Tonight, in a badly beaten team, in a terrible team... his impact on the game was felt. If he wanted to be here, we'd be **** fools to think we're too good for him and that we dont need or want him. We've got a **** hot forward pack, it's very good. He'd be the best player in the pack instantly. And you can argue that with a wall, i'm not interested.

If he becomes available again, i think we'll be interested and make serious offers and we should. But i dont expect that to be the case. He re-signed there for reasons that are his own and i dont think a tough start to the year changes much about that decision

He doesn’t want to be in Canberra. He’s told us that twice. How many more times does he have to tell us? If he were to change his mind, fine. But he’s definitely a hot and cold player. I suspect Stuart told him he needs a much harder edge, more consistency, and if he came to Canberra, Stuart could help him develop, as he has with a lot of forwards. But no, David said, no not interested, twice. And money wasn’t the issue either by the looks.

Edge players are hot and cold when they're in bad teams with **** halves
That's just the nature of the position. They're heavily reliant on the half to be successful. Kikau is a great example. Consistently huge impacts on games when he was playing outside great halves. Goes to a new club and now it's a little more hit and miss.
Put Fifita on the Panthers and he's the best forward in the world. Cant do it all yourself as an edge.

But yes your first sentences sums it up... he's told us twice he doesnt want to want to come here and i dont expect that view has changed. But if he were to change his mind... fine indeed!
We'd be lucky to have him.

[Billy Walker]

I can not imagine watching David Fifita play and thinking "na, im good. I dont want that player"
Tonight, in a badly beaten team, in a terrible team... his impact on the game was felt. If he wanted to be here, we'd be **** fools to think we're too good for him and that we dont need or want him. We've got a **** hot forward pack, it's very good. He'd be the best player in the pack instantly. And you can argue that with a wall, i'm not interested.

If he becomes available again, i think we'll be interested and make serious offers and we should. But i dont expect that to be the case. He re-signed there for reasons that are his own and i dont think a tough start to the year changes much about that decision

He doesn’t want to be in Canberra. He’s told us that twice. How many more times does he have to tell us? If he were to change his mind, fine. But he’s definitely a hot and cold player. I suspect Stuart told him he needs a much harder edge, more consistency, and if he came to Canberra, Stuart could help him develop, as he has with a lot of forwards. But no, David said, no not interested, twice. And money wasn’t the issue either by the looks.

Edge players are hot and cold when they're in bad teams with **** halves
That's just the nature of the position. They're heavily reliant on the half to be successful. Kikau is a great example. Consistently huge impacts on games when he was playing outside great halves. Goes to a new club and now it's a little more hit and miss.
Put Fifita on the Panthers and he's the best forward in the world. Cant do it all yourself as an edge.

But yes your first sentences sums it up... he's told us twice he doesnt want to want to come here and i dont expect that view has changed. But if he were to change his mind... fine indeed!
We'd be lucky to have him.

Well said

[greeneyed]

Having any second thoughts Botman?

[Botman]

None at all
If you want to say "He's knocked us back twice im tired of chasing something and being consistently told no, time to move on" i get that.
There is only so many times you should ask someone to dance and be told no before you need to accept they're just not into you and you gotta go find someone else to dance with.

But to pretend like the dude isnt that good and we're better off without him... people, please... get out of your damn feelings and get **** serious.
He's the best player at his position, no question about it. No one impacts a game like him at his position. No one has the presence and impacts defence like he does simply by existing. No one can dominant a game at edge forward position like he can. He's not coming and we should probably move on to other targets... but pretending this guy isnt a complete **** stud is such bad faith copium
He said no, that sucks. No need to act like jilted lovers.

[greeneyed]

He is obviously very good when he’s hot. Outstanding. Best in the league. But I stand by what I said earlier. And I agree with Stuart. Fifita is not playing to his potential consistently. He puts in far too many half hearted games. And I do think turning us down showed he wasn’t interested in being challenged more. Life’s too easy on the glitter strip.

[Ruben Daley]

It’s very unlikely he’d come but if he did, I think a part of the decision would be to see if he can go from the ‘good when he’s hot’ guy to a guy who’s consistently great. I also think he would get there under Ricky.

So when we talk about whether he’s worth it or not, I factor in that he’d potentially be coming with a better mindset and therefore would contribute more than what we see at the Titans who, just quietly, are deadset woeful.

That might all be in my head or be a desperate attempt to spin the Corey Parker perspective on Canberra as a destination into a positive. But I truly think we’d see peak Fifita if he came.

[Botman]

Genuinely curious... can anyone name me an elite edge forward in modern history who has performed consistently at his potential when playing in a bottom 4 team?

There is a reason why you (probably) cant. In the modern game of RL, there is no position more reliant on the halves, structure and quality around them than Edge forward. Which is why i've been forward in saying it's the final piece you buy, not a foundational piece. You need the spine sorted before you spend on edge forward because without the quality play inside it, an edge is wasted.

We have foundational peices in place at a relatively low cost. We should be a team swinging for an impact edge who can be an outlet peice for Sanders/Strange imo

[Rickmando]

The club should be kicking the tyres on everybody. We aren’t in a position to ever get complacent about where our playing list is at - especially when it comes to ceiling-raisers, a type of player we aren’t particularly flush with.

If Fifita is disgruntled (and how could he not be) then let’s have one more go at trying to get him into the lime green.

However, if he knocks us back then I believe the next big-ticket recruitment target needs to be us throwing big overs at a spine player. Big overs, as in ~1.5x the current rate, re-setting the market for the position. The club has proved for years it can shop in the bargain bin, we’ve been employing the “stars and scrubs” strategy but forgetting to add the stars. Time to make a splash.

[Ruben Daley]

Genuinely curious... can anyone name me an elite edge forward in modern history who has performed consistently at his potential when playing in a bottom 4 team?

There is a reason why you (probably) cant. In the modern game of RL, there is no position more reliant on the halves, structure and quality around them than Edge forward. Which is why i've been forward in saying it's the final piece you buy, not a foundational piece. You need the spine sorted before you spend on edge forward because without the quality play inside it, an edge is wasted.

We have foundational peices in place at a relatively low cost. We should be a team swinging for an impact edge who can be an outlet peice for Sanders/Strange imo

Completely agree.

I’m a big Liam Martin fan but put him in the Titans and he’d be a different guy. He’d still hit hard and work his bum off but he’d be nowhere near the Origin conversation.

As has been said, Kikau has been the same at the Dogs. Looks great some weeks but isn’t sighted other weeks.

Same goes for Bateman and Fake Papali’i.

Give Fifita the chance to play in a decent team week in, week out and he’d dominate.

And while we’re not the Panthers, I think we could offer a system to help Fifita do that.

[Rickmando]

Genuinely curious... can anyone name me an elite edge forward in modern history who has performed consistently at his potential when playing in a bottom 4 team?

There is a reason why you (probably) cant. In the modern game of RL, there is no position more reliant on the halves, structure and quality around them than Edge forward. Which is why i've been forward in saying it's the final piece you buy, not a foundational piece. You need the spine sorted before you spend on edge forward because without the quality play inside it, an edge is wasted.

We have foundational peices in place at a relatively low cost. We should be a team swinging for an impact edge who can be an outlet peice for Sanders/Strange imo

Completely agree.

I’m a big Liam Martin fan but put him in the Titans and he’d be a different guy. He’d still hit hard and work his bum off but he’d be nowhere near the Origin conversation.

As has been said, Kikau has been the same at the Dogs. Looks great some weeks but isn’t sighted other weeks.

Same goes for Bateman and Fake Papali’i.

Give Fifita the chance to play in a decent team week in, week out and he’d dominate.

And while we’re not the Panthers, I think we could offer a system to help Fifita do that.

I’m not sure I’d go as far as to use the term “system” - as the key messages of our system seems to consist of “get in the grind”, “don’t make mistakes” and “bleed green”.

However, we do have is a strong culture that gets good effort out of the playing group more often than not, and a number of promising juniors that are exciting when you take a 1-3 year view of things. Dropping player of Fifita’s calibre into that situation, regardless of the position he plays, should see an improvement in results and make us a lot more exciting to watch.

And we certainly should find a way to cash in on a period where we are paying these up and comers below-market rates for their positions for the time being.

[Seiffert82]

It’s very unlikely he’d come but if he did, I think a part of the decision would be to see if he can go from the ‘good when he’s hot’ guy to a guy who’s consistently great. I also think he would get there under Ricky.

So when we talk about whether he’s worth it or not, I factor in that he’d potentially be coming with a better mindset and therefore would contribute more than what we see at the Titans who, just quietly, are deadset woeful.

That might all be in my head or be a desperate attempt to spin the Corey Parker perspective on Canberra as a destination into a positive. But I truly think we’d see peak Fifita if he came.

I believe so too, but his heart would have to be on becoming a consistently great player, rather than whatever lifestyle choice (or weather) he thinks he'd be missing by moving from the Gold Coast.

He came down here to check out the facilities. To that extent he obviously considered the idea of coming here, but I just think he's way too focused on lifestyle to reach his full potential anywhere.

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[NoMan]

I don’t think much has changed since he last took the Titans deal, so if he walks away from a million dollar+ lifestyle deal to come to Canberra then it would be a pretty clear indicator he is getting serious.

It’s not like an offer from the Raiders is an offer from Brisbane or the Roosters where he potentially could win a comp and take the piss.

[The Nickman]

Having any second thoughts Botman?

Hahahaha that’s such a good call that went completely over ol’ Botto’s head then.

[-PJ-]

Have we missed OUT or not ?

Can we get a confirmative ?

[Ruben Daley]

I’m not sure I’d go as far as to use the term “system” - as the key messages of our system seems to consist of “get in the grind”, “don’t make mistakes” and “bleed green”.

However, we do have is a strong culture that gets good effort out of the playing group more often than not, and a number of promising juniors that are exciting when you take a 1-3 year view of things. Dropping player of Fifita’s calibre into that situation, regardless of the position he plays, should see an improvement in results and make us a lot more exciting to watch.

And we certainly should find a way to cash in on a period where we are paying these up and comers below-market rates for their positions for the time being.

Haha. Yeah, ‘system’ might’ve been hyperbole there.

Agree about cashing in while we’re transitioning. I don’t think it’s make or break but we won’t have cap space for big signings if/when our youngsters become established.

I believe so too, but his heart would have to be on becoming a consistently great player, rather than whatever lifestyle choice (or weather) he thinks he'd be missing by moving from the Gold Coast.

He came down here to check out the facilities. To that extent he obviously considered the idea of coming here, but I just think he's way too focused on lifestyle to reach his full potential anywhere.

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Yeah, it’d all be down to his heart and mind. My point was I don’t think he’d choose us if he hadn’t had a big change in heart and mind.

So if he comes, I’d be confident we’d see his best.

[Rickmando]

Have we missed OUT or not ?

Can we get a confirmative ?

We are tentative about wheeling out the ramp by the sounds of it

[dubby]

None at all
If you want to say "He's knocked us back twice im tired of chasing something and being consistently told no, time to move on" i get that.
There is only so many times you should ask someone to dance and be told no before you need to accept they're just not into you and you gotta go find someone else to dance with.

But to pretend like the dude isnt that good and we're better off without him... people, please... get out of your damn feelings and get **** serious.
He's the best player at his position, no question about it. No one impacts a game like him at his position. No one has the presence and impacts defence like he does simply by existing. No one can dominant a game at edge forward position like he can. He's not coming and we should probably move on to other targets... but pretending this guy isnt a complete **** stud is such bad faith copium
He said no, that sucks. No need to act like jilted lovers.

I'm not dropping Hudson or Hosking for him.

Especially considering the price.

And, as we all know, we don't have the best spine. Which makes him hot and cold, right?

[dubby]

It's all moot, anyway.

He's not coming.

[Botman]

“I'm not dropping Hudson or Hosking for him.”

Cool, I’m out.

[dubby]

“I'm not dropping Hudson or Hosking for him.”

Cool, I’m out.

Yeah. For a bloke that's knocked us back twice, wants circa $1 million per season and is as inconsistent as climate change predictions, I'm happy with our lads.

[Billy Walker]

“I'm not dropping Hudson or Hosking for him.”

Cool, I’m out.

I’m going to give him the benefit of the doubt - he meant to say “I’m not dropping Hudson and Hosking for him”. I mean that’s a more sensible discussion right, would the raiders be stronger playing with only I second rower if that second rower was Fifita or the two second rowers we currently have? Fair debate.

[Botman]

Except that was never what the scenario was. We were chasing after Fifita when Young locked into one position. So give him that BOTD all you like, that's a fabricated scenario that has never been on the cards or mentioned as an option and Dubs hasnt put that forth either

But by all means have the debate. Knock yourself out.
But there is no productive or interesting conversation for me if the starting point is "'I would not drop Hudson Young or Zac Hosking for David Fifita" Good luck to you.

[dubby]

Except that was never what the scenario was. We were chasing after Fifita when Young locked into one position. So give him that BOTD all you like, that's a fabricated scenario that has never been on the cards or mentioned as an option and Dubs hasnt put that forth either

But by all means have the debate. Knock yourself out.
But there is no productive or interesting conversation for me if the starting point is "'I would not drop Hudson Young or Zac Hosking for David Fifita" Good luck to you.

So what's your stance?

How would you make it work?

[dubby]

And FTR, I'm not disputing Fifitas ability. He's a monster. When it suits him.

I'm talking his attitude, his price, his value for money.

He has knocked us back twice.

And I think it's a little unwise to pay him the money he wants based on output.

If it was Payne Haas or Tino it's a different conversation. They deliver consistently.

[Billy Walker]

Except that was never what the scenario was. We were chasing after Fifita when Young locked into one position. So give him that BOTD all you like, that's a fabricated scenario that has never been on the cards or mentioned as an option and Dubs hasnt put that forth either

But by all means have the debate. Knock yourself out.
But there is no productive or interesting conversation for me if the starting point is "'I would not drop Hudson Young or Zac Hosking for David Fifita" Good luck to you.

So what's your stance?

How would you make it work?

David Fifita first selected in his most preferred position and everyone selected around that with someone shuffling out to accommodate him. We aren’t tinkering with a premiership winning team, we are bringing a world standard player in to make the side better. This isn’t a tough one.

[dubby]

Except that was never what the scenario was. We were chasing after Fifita when Young locked into one position. So give him that BOTD all you like, that's a fabricated scenario that has never been on the cards or mentioned as an option and Dubs hasnt put that forth either

But by all means have the debate. Knock yourself out.
But there is no productive or interesting conversation for me if the starting point is "'I would not drop Hudson Young or Zac Hosking for David Fifita" Good luck to you.

So what's your stance?

How would you make it work?

David Fifita first selected in his most preferred position and everyone selected around that with someone shuffling out to accommodate him. We aren’t tinkering with a premiership winning team, we are bringing a world standard player in to make the side better. This isn’t a tough one.

He's paid more than Hosking, Young combined.

Based on his form the past 2 years, and his price tag, and our mediocre spine, is he the player you target?

[Billy Walker]

Except that was never what the scenario was. We were chasing after Fifita when Young locked into one position. So give him that BOTD all you like, that's a fabricated scenario that has never been on the cards or mentioned as an option and Dubs hasnt put that forth either

But by all means have the debate. Knock yourself out.
But there is no productive or interesting conversation for me if the starting point is "'I would not drop Hudson Young or Zac Hosking for David Fifita" Good luck to you.

So what's your stance?

How would you make it work?

David Fifita first selected in his most preferred position and everyone selected around that with someone shuffling out to accommodate him. We aren’t tinkering with a premiership winning team, we are bringing a world standard player in to make the side better. This isn’t a tough one.

He's paid more than Hosking, Young combined.

Based on his form the past 2 years, and his price tag, and our mediocre spine, is he the player you target?

Not sure Cleary, Munster or Grant are on the market. If we want to get better we need players who can move the dial and offer us more than what we have now. Fifita does that. Give him EW and CHN money and we should be fairly sweet.

[dubby]

At what point do you stop chasing a player that has knocked you back twice?

He doesn't want to be here.

[Seiffert82]

His time on the field vs the Dolphins leads me to feel he has no intention of leaving the Titans.

Off the bench there was every excuse for him to phone it in, but on this occasion he didn't.

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[Seiffert82]

At what point do you stop chasing a player that has knocked you back twice?

He doesn't want to be here.

Three times. Tops.

Maybe four.

Lol.

[dubby]

At what point do you stop chasing a player that has knocked you back twice?

He doesn't want to be here.

Three times. Tops.

Maybe four.

Lol.

Haha.

I have more self-respect than that.

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[gerg]

Genuinely curious... can anyone name me an elite edge forward in modern history who has performed consistently at his potential when playing in a bottom 4 team?

Just watching today the only ones I can think of are Tariq Sims and Frizzell at a deplorable dragons. Frizzell may have played lock then though?

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[Billy Walker]

Interesting read - essentially saying the crazy Fifita release cause position him as judge and jury on Des’ coaching

Des Hasler about to claim his biggest victim as disaster looms: https://www.news.com.au/sport/nrl/des-h ... 692a1f669d