Coronavirus

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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

greeneyed wrote:If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
It's one thing to make a personal decision not to have it. It's another thing to attempt to highjack a centre administrating it to people who have made a personal decision to have it. Antivaxxers are the worst.
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-TW-
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by -TW- »

The rate of anaphylaxis associated with the Pfizer Comirnaty vaccine is 20/1mil doses in Australia.

Will that stop you getting that one, seeing the chance of having an anaphylactic event is actually higher than getting blood clots which is 18/1.8 mil doses

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-1 ... 13-05-2021

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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

Anaphylaxis adrenaline

Problem solved
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Dr Zaius wrote: June 5, 2021, 11:19 pm
greeneyed wrote:If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
It's one thing to make a personal decision not to have it. It's another thing to attempt to highjack a centre administrating it to people who have made a personal decision to have it. Antivaxxers are the worst.
Who said I was advocating that? My post was responding to irvste.
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

-TW- wrote: June 5, 2021, 11:20 pm The rate of anaphylaxis associated with the Pfizer Comirnaty vaccine is 20/1mil doses in Australia.

Will that stop you getting that one, seeing the chance of having an anaphylactic event is actually higher than getting blood clots which is 18/1.8 mil doses

https://www.tga.gov.au/periodic/covid-1 ... 13-05-2021

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No. That’s unlikely to kill me. I’ve never had such a reaction in any case. I take plenty of vaccines. I’m not taking one which the USA has not approved for use on their own citizens... they’ve had plenty of time to do so, but have not. And one which we know can kill people.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Postman Pat »

I had my first Pfizer vac yesterday, I feel absolutely fine and I’m booked in for my second on the 25th.
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the bone
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by the bone »

Whilst the FDA is waiting for AZ to show results from a large scale trial, it should also be noted that the US has an abundance of vaccines made by American companies (Pfizer, J&J and Moderna), so there's no need for them to rush an approval for AZ (a British company).
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by The Nickman »

I have to admit I’m not taking the AZ vaccine either. I’ll be registering to take the Pfizer shot in the next few weeks, and preferably on a Monday.

If I have any ill effects from the vaccine I want them to be on a Tuesday/Wednesday. No way I want it screwing up my weekend.
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-TW-
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by -TW- »

My worst effects were about 48 hrs after

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Re: Coronavirus

Post by The Nickman »

-TW- wrote:My worst effects were about 48 hrs after

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Yeah, my wife felt worst two days after the shot rather than the next day.

Which is why I want a Monday shot, want to be well clear of it by the weekend.
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: June 5, 2021, 11:19 pm
greeneyed wrote:If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
It's one thing to make a personal decision not to have it. It's another thing to attempt to highjack a centre administrating it to people who have made a personal decision to have it. Antivaxxers are the worst.
Who said I was advocating that? My post was responding to irvste.
No one. I'm referring to the idiots picketing the vaccine centre. All though you did open with "it's understandable"
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Northern Raider
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Northern Raider »

My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Dr Zaius wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:06 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: June 5, 2021, 11:19 pm
greeneyed wrote:If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
It's one thing to make a personal decision not to have it. It's another thing to attempt to highjack a centre administrating it to people who have made a personal decision to have it. Antivaxxers are the worst.
Who said I was advocating that? My post was responding to irvste.
No one. I'm referring to the idiots picketing the vaccine centre. All though you did open with "it's understandable"
But that post didn't exist when I started my post...
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Northern Raider wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:22 pm My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
I've seen what blood clots have done to my father... first when he had a stroke, then when he had more blood clots when immobilised by the stroke... which went to his lungs and that nearly killed him too. He didn't die... but the effects are long lasting. All it takes is for one of those clots to travel to your brain or other vital organ... You can treat them with blood thinners... but by then it is too late.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by irvste »

Am feeling a bit ordinary today.. Fever chills headache but is what it is..

My parents may be convinced to not take either vaccine... That's not great given their 74 to 79 age range

I otherwise get the trepidation with astra.. I need to travel for work soon and my decision on taking astra now rather than waiting was partly based on that

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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

greeneyed wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:29 pm
Dr Zaius wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:06 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: June 5, 2021, 11:19 pm
greeneyed wrote:If they’re refusing the AstraZeneca vaccine I totally understand. It can give you blood clots and kill you. When the government offers me a safe vaccine I’ll be first in line. But they’re only offering the vaccine that can kill you, to old people in Australia. Doesn’t matter if you lose a few old people I guess is their thinking. Meanwhile, the USA is refusing to allow its use in their own country... but they’re giving their stocks of AstraZeneca to poor countries... If it’s not good enough for the citizens of the USA I’m certainly not taking it.
It's one thing to make a personal decision not to have it. It's another thing to attempt to highjack a centre administrating it to people who have made a personal decision to have it. Antivaxxers are the worst.
Who said I was advocating that? My post was responding to irvste.
No one. I'm referring to the idiots picketing the vaccine centre. All though you did open with "it's understandable"
But that post didn't exist when I started my post...
I see, you were referring the previous post. My apologies. As you were
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

greeneyed wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:32 pm
Northern Raider wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:22 pm My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
I've seen what blood clots have done to my father... first when he had a stroke, then when he had more blood clots when immobilised by the stroke... which went to his lungs and that nearly killed him too. He didn't die... but the effects are long lasting. All it takes is for one of those clots to travel to your brain or other vital organ... You can treat them with blood thinners... but by then it is too late.
Different mechanism, and different treatment though GE.
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

irvste wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:36 pm Am feeling a bit ordinary today.. Fever chills headache but is what it is..

My parents may be convinced to not take either vaccine... That's not great given their 74 to 79 age range

I otherwise get the trepidation with astra.. I need to travel for work soon and my decision on taking astra now rather than waiting was partly based on that

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Side effects of the AZ are generally worst after the first dose, Pfizer worst after the second. Hopefully you breeze through your second one.
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Dr Zaius wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:45 pm
greeneyed wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:32 pm
Northern Raider wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:22 pm My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
I've seen what blood clots have done to my father... first when he had a stroke, then when he had more blood clots when immobilised by the stroke... which went to his lungs and that nearly killed him too. He didn't die... but the effects are long lasting. All it takes is for one of those clots to travel to your brain or other vital organ... You can treat them with blood thinners... but by then it is too late.
Different mechanism, and different treatment though GE.
But they have the same effects don't they?
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Northern Raider »

greeneyed wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:32 pm
Northern Raider wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:22 pm My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
I've seen what blood clots have done to my father... first when he had a stroke, then when he had more blood clots when immobilised by the stroke... which went to his lungs and that nearly killed him too. He didn't die... but the effects are long lasting. All it takes is for one of those clots to travel to your brain or other vital organ... You can treat them with blood thinners... but by then it is too late.
I suffered a blood clot myself 2 years ago. My cousin has had several. They are dangerous, no question. Also comparatively common. Blood thinners are part of the treatment. The clotting condition related to the AZ vax is different. It's clotting with low platelet count and is not treated the same.
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:45 pm
greeneyed wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:32 pm
Northern Raider wrote: June 6, 2021, 12:22 pm My understanding of the clotting potentially caused by the AZ vax is that it's really only deadly if left untreated. We've had 1 death in this country from a couple of million injections. By contrast COVID has resulted in more than 900 deaths from 30,000 cases.
I've seen what blood clots have done to my father... first when he had a stroke, then when he had more blood clots when immobilised by the stroke... which went to his lungs and that nearly killed him too. He didn't die... but the effects are long lasting. All it takes is for one of those clots to travel to your brain or other vital organ... You can treat them with blood thinners... but by then it is too late.
Different mechanism, and different treatment though GE.
But they have the same effects don't they?
The main clot of concern has been a sagital sinus thrombosis, which is like the main vein in your brain. It can cause stroke, yes. They don't go on blood thinners though.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by irvste »

The Nickman wrote:
-TW- wrote:My worst effects were about 48 hrs after

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Yeah, my wife felt worst two days after the shot rather than the next day.

Which is why I want a Monday shot, want to be well clear of it by the weekend.
For me it was the night of and day after..so from 6 to 30 hours after.. Day 2 I've been fine

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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Covid-19 scare in Sunshine Coast after Melbourne couple escape lockdown, one tests positive: https://www.news.com.au/national/queens ... 70eaf58b78

Seriously...


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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Northern Raider »

Left a COVID hotspot during lockdown. Travelled across 2 states. Had symptoms. Only got tested a few days later because it was a work requirement. Even went out in public while awaiting results. This hits new levels of irresponsibility.
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Re: Coronavirus

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I'm secretly and ashamedly hoping for two weeks lockdown

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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Australian woman dies from blood clots after AstraZeneca vaccine: https://au.news.yahoo.com/australian-wo ... 09524.html
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-TW-
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by -TW- »

That's 2 in 3.8 million doses.

Higher chance of winning Div 2 in the lotto

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gangrenous
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

For death, much better odds of clots
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Personally, I won’t be treating the death of anyone who takes a vaccine lightly, particularly when we know that there are much safer vaccines available. In my view, the Australian government should be withdrawing the AstraZenneca vaccine as soon as possible, as they have in Norway, as they are doing in Canada. It’s never been approved in the USA and they are shipping their stocks out to less developed countries. 😳 This is the very reason anti-vax campaigns are so successful. People are not going to trust what governments tell them, when they have drugs on the market that they know have side effects that kill people.

The most disturbing thing is that the Australian government is telling older people that the only vaccine they can have is the one that can kill you. They’re telling old people that this vaccine is OK for old people... and they’re the ones dying and developing blood clots, which have severe and debilitating effects. Doesn’t seem to concern them in the slightest.

Not so long ago, the Australian government was telling us that the AstraZeneca vaccine was safe for everyone. Now they say, not safe for people under 50. How long until they say it’s not safe for anyone? Meanwhile, the unsafe vaccine keeps being injected into old people.
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

No Covid vaccines have approval in the US. Three have emergency authorisation. Astra Zeneca have not applied for either. Antivaxxers deal in half truths. Be sure of your facts GE.

https://www.nbcchicago.com/news/coronav ... 2/2524845/

https://www.reuters.com/world/us/astraz ... 021-05-07/
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greeneyed
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

I'm quite aware of the facts. I know that there are millions of people in the USA receiving COVID vaccines and AstraZeneca isn't one of them. And I'm quite aware of what happening in Australia in relation to that vaccine. You seem to be suggesting that I'm somehow listening or reading material from anti-vaxers. That is far from the truth. I'm reading what's on CNN and mainstream media. And reaching quite sensible conclusions. And you are the person who told us that it would be better if our vaccine program in Australia didn't include the AstraZeneca vaccine.
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-TW-
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by -TW- »

Yet they have Johnson and Johnson which has the same side effect with the same probability

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... ow-so-far/

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Re: Coronavirus

Post by The Nickman »

Is it really a 1 in 2 million chance of developing blood clots?

Because if so... c’monnn
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gangrenous
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

No, of dying from them.

More like 1 in 80k or so
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