Canberra Raiders interest in Matt Dufty goes cold
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- Mr. Snrub
- Tom Learoyd-Lahrs
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I don't get the Dufty hype. CNK is safe as houses at the back. Very efficient, gets through a ton of work, huge metre eater. He'd be wasted at centre.
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I appreciate the way Snrub thinks.
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I think I we pull out it's a huge mistake.
We have no spark. I'd hate to see the stat's about us scoring a try where our set starts 50 m out or more without requiring a 6 again call
We need spark n points, fullback has turned into the most attacking position and he can ball play which will cover some deficiencies in others (I have always thought n still do that was the worst part of Jack's game, is he can't read n ball play, it all looks premeditated for me)
No brainer for me, even with his faults
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We have no spark. I'd hate to see the stat's about us scoring a try where our set starts 50 m out or more without requiring a 6 again call
We need spark n points, fullback has turned into the most attacking position and he can ball play which will cover some deficiencies in others (I have always thought n still do that was the worst part of Jack's game, is he can't read n ball play, it all looks premeditated for me)
No brainer for me, even with his faults
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- CanberraJonno
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Instagram also claiming he's meeting with Warriors this week:
I still think the Duffman will sign with the Raiders, ohhh yeah.
I still think the Duffman will sign with the Raiders, ohhh yeah.
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- Mal Meninga
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
EDITafgtnk wrote:No credible, properly run club could base their recruitment of a player based on one game.
- Raiders_Pat
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
If it's say $500k, I'd say take him. Once it starts getting higher than that it starts to become questionable.
- Canberra Milk
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Which clubs would be interested in CNK as their starting fullback? Barring the bottom 2 teams, only us and Dragons would consider him. Possibly Warriors if they shift Walsh to five eighth. That's 12 of 16 teams he wouldn't get a look in, including the top 7Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 4:10 pmThe game has changed, momentum is another level from where it was last year. Yet we should have been 4-0 with CNK fit to start the year, save for a double KO and 2 metre forward pass vs the Warriors.Canberra Milk wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 1:08 pm Yep the game is very different this year to last, that should be abundantly obvious. Last year you could still grind. This year I'm not sure if you can. CNK was not effective last year, his flaws just didn't matter as much
Dufty's flaws aside, I'd be disappointed if we withdrew from Dufty and ended up with say Widdop
I just don't like the bury the head in the sand everything is going to resolve itself attitude to the Dufty signing. He's a tier 2 fullback somewhere in the middle of the road. Can you really imagine there being no interest in CNK if he went to market? It's just that we need points more than we need D at this point in time, plenty of other teams in the opposite position.
CNK can work inside a functioning attacking system, like Dylan Edwards does at the Panthers, *or*, a grinding defensive team. We're not the former. If we're hoping to be the latter, I fear that could be a very big mistake under Vlandysball
Of course you could also back CNK to simply improve his ballplaying. That may happen. But he's shown no signs of it yet, and we should be preparing for the likely possibly that that continues
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Simmo at FB was pretty damn good last game, and he should improve.
- Canberra Milk
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I'm guessing it's the money that's stalling it at the moment, hence his meeting Warriors. We may be negotiating fairly and and so we shouldRaiders_Pat wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 5:56 pm If it's say $500k, I'd say take him. Once it starts getting higher than that it starts to become questionable.
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
As far as I can see, no reputable media outlet is reporting this. I wouldn't regard that as a reputable source. To the contrary... this NZ media report was issued this afternoon:
"Stuff.co.nz understands the Warriors aren’t interested in Corey Norman or Matt Dufty who have both been told they won’t be wanted by the Dragons next season."
Read more: https://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/league/wa ... nt-release
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- Simon Woolford
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I don’t know how people can say CNK doesn’t have speed when he almost chased down Dufty (from well behind) 90 metres 10 minutes after he stepped past him to score a try...
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
We need to score points. Points wins games. The game has shifted towards quick play the balls and good attacking structures. If defence was 60% important now its down to 40/45%.Canberra Milk wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 5:59 pmWhich clubs would be interested in CNK as their starting fullback? Barring the bottom 2 teams, only us and Dragons would consider him. Possibly Warriors if they shift Walsh to five eighth. That's 12 of 16 teams he wouldn't get a look in, including the top 7Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 4:10 pmThe game has changed, momentum is another level from where it was last year. Yet we should have been 4-0 with CNK fit to start the year, save for a double KO and 2 metre forward pass vs the Warriors.Canberra Milk wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 1:08 pm Yep the game is very different this year to last, that should be abundantly obvious. Last year you could still grind. This year I'm not sure if you can. CNK was not effective last year, his flaws just didn't matter as much
Dufty's flaws aside, I'd be disappointed if we withdrew from Dufty and ended up with say Widdop
I just don't like the bury the head in the sand everything is going to resolve itself attitude to the Dufty signing. He's a tier 2 fullback somewhere in the middle of the road. Can you really imagine there being no interest in CNK if he went to market? It's just that we need points more than we need D at this point in time, plenty of other teams in the opposite position.
CNK can work inside a functioning attacking system, like Dylan Edwards does at the Panthers, *or*, a grinding defensive team. We're not the former. If we're hoping to be the latter, I fear that could be a very big mistake under Vlandysball
Of course you could also back CNK to simply improve his ballplaying. That may happen. But he's shown no signs of it yet, and we should be preparing for the likely possibly that that continues
Scoring tries also means less time defending.
Bailey has potential to be a lot better and already has good ball playing skills and could be a potential longer term FB if we dont get Dufty.
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- John Ferguson
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
FB MUST PASS!
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
CNK can't pass
FB MUST PASS!
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Of course. it's not like we've had any real success with CNK at full back in the 2 years he has been with the club. Teams like the dragons demonstrate how important it is to have a fullback who "can pass"
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
NRL.com suggesting we are still to decide whether to make Dufty an offer.
Dragons clear way for Widdop to join Raiders or Warriors
St George Illawarra have advised Gareth Widdop's manager they would not stand in the way of Canberra or the Warriors signing the former Dragons captain if he returns from England before the end of the season.
The Raiders are also monitoring the form of out-of-favour St George Illawarra fullback Matt Dufty, who toured the club's facilities and met with coach Ricky Stuart last Thursday. However, the club is yet to decide whether to make an offer to Dufty.
Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2021/06/15/dra ... riors/amp/
Dragons clear way for Widdop to join Raiders or Warriors
St George Illawarra have advised Gareth Widdop's manager they would not stand in the way of Canberra or the Warriors signing the former Dragons captain if he returns from England before the end of the season.
The Raiders are also monitoring the form of out-of-favour St George Illawarra fullback Matt Dufty, who toured the club's facilities and met with coach Ricky Stuart last Thursday. However, the club is yet to decide whether to make an offer to Dufty.
Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2021/06/15/dra ... riors/amp/
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Think regardless of whether or not we sign Dufty, CNK's days as a fullback here are numbered FROG. If it's not Dufty, we'll move onto the next target or in-house option.
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
The club signalling their interests in Dufty and Hynes suggests they are of the belief that they need more ball playing out of the fullback position.
Unless they land a prodigious halfback talent that can fill the creative void, hard to imagine they'll wake up and decide that's the wrong way to go.
How long CNK has that job will depend entirely on how long it takes the club to find his replacement.
Unless they land a prodigious halfback talent that can fill the creative void, hard to imagine they'll wake up and decide that's the wrong way to go.
How long CNK has that job will depend entirely on how long it takes the club to find his replacement.
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- John Ferguson
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
If our centres ( timoko HSS or CNK) and forwards are firing and we keep Hodgson.. we can win a comp with this group.. yes with Sam at 7 and bailes more developed.. Boom!
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I thunk the club knows CNK will debunk to NZ at some point and are being proactive instead of reactive.
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Jury is also out on Tigers, Sharks and Cowboys current fullback solutions. I'd definitely have him over Will Kennedy myself.Canberra Milk wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 5:59 pmWhich clubs would be interested in CNK as their starting fullback? Barring the bottom 2 teams, only us and Dragons would consider him. Possibly Warriors if they shift Walsh to five eighth. That's 12 of 16 teams he wouldn't get a look in, including the top 7Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 4:10 pmThe game has changed, momentum is another level from where it was last year. Yet we should have been 4-0 with CNK fit to start the year, save for a double KO and 2 metre forward pass vs the Warriors.Canberra Milk wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 1:08 pm Yep the game is very different this year to last, that should be abundantly obvious. Last year you could still grind. This year I'm not sure if you can. CNK was not effective last year, his flaws just didn't matter as much
Dufty's flaws aside, I'd be disappointed if we withdrew from Dufty and ended up with say Widdop
I just don't like the bury the head in the sand everything is going to resolve itself attitude to the Dufty signing. He's a tier 2 fullback somewhere in the middle of the road. Can you really imagine there being no interest in CNK if he went to market? It's just that we need points more than we need D at this point in time, plenty of other teams in the opposite position.
CNK can work inside a functioning attacking system, like Dylan Edwards does at the Panthers, *or*, a grinding defensive team. We're not the former. If we're hoping to be the latter, I fear that could be a very big mistake under Vlandysball
Of course you could also back CNK to simply improve his ballplaying. That may happen. But he's shown no signs of it yet, and we should be preparing for the likely possibly that that continues
I agree it's unlikely CNK suddenly switches into a quality ballplayer at this stage and no argument Dufty would be an upgrade in that facet. Just not sure it's worth locking into a player who has plenty of his own flaws, guess it depends if you think he opens our premiership window up. My opinion is he doesn't, and halfback is where we need to be spending big $$$ Whether we can get anyone worth the $$$ is another story.
Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Not just unlikely
it's pretty much unprecedented at this point. And again, it's not just really high level ball playing but it's even basic catch and pass, its so rare. The ball dies with him so often and it can not, IMO, be overstated how debilitating that is to our offence, particularly in the red zone.
But he is who he is. And as i've said a number of times now, i absolutely get people who say they'd take him over Dufty. I really do. I think there is a lot of validity to the arguements raised on that side of this. He's EXCELLENT at so many parts of fullback play, and it positively contributes to winning. He's awesome at what he does.
This thing, IMO, comes down to each posters philosophical idea on how to win in 2021 and beyond is. I myself favour offence and i think that's where the game is headed. But i completely and totally accept people who are on the other side of this.
it's pretty much unprecedented at this point. And again, it's not just really high level ball playing but it's even basic catch and pass, its so rare. The ball dies with him so often and it can not, IMO, be overstated how debilitating that is to our offence, particularly in the red zone.
But he is who he is. And as i've said a number of times now, i absolutely get people who say they'd take him over Dufty. I really do. I think there is a lot of validity to the arguements raised on that side of this. He's EXCELLENT at so many parts of fullback play, and it positively contributes to winning. He's awesome at what he does.
This thing, IMO, comes down to each posters philosophical idea on how to win in 2021 and beyond is. I myself favour offence and i think that's where the game is headed. But i completely and totally accept people who are on the other side of this.
- Raiders_Pat
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I personally think people are blind if they can't see that our lack of ability to find points is going to hinder us moving forward. None of the top teams are particularly defensive-minded teams like Storm in previous years or us in 2019. Even the Storm have become an "attacking" team now, very much so compared to how they were a few years ago. You have to have good attack to have good defence these days... if you can't find points, you will find yourself behind quickly - just as we have been finding ourselves all season against the good sides. Upgrading FB is a no-brainer, particularly when the guy in the position is on centre/winger money and would also be an upgrade for us moving in to that position. I can agree with a lot of the arguments against Dufty but the one I can't agree with at all is the notion that CNK is the man for us at FB because we need to be thinking defensively, or whatever the argument is supposed to be...
- Raiders_Pat
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I've said it a thousand times but it comes down to the price and hopefully the club will assess that correctly. As botman mentioned, at the very least the club has identified it as a position they're looking to upgrade and that gives me confidence that we're thinking in the right direction with our recruitment.
- Seiffert82
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I fear Dufty will be a dud, but it depends on whether he buys into Stuart's defensive mindset.
You do need some X factor to win big games. Massive gamble though. He's the type of player that delivers you a 10-40 blowout when he's under pressure.
You do need some X factor to win big games. Massive gamble though. He's the type of player that delivers you a 10-40 blowout when he's under pressure.
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
If we go down the CNK path we need whiteheed to move to lock and be the in between link guy for the halves. (Worried our coaching staff don't think like this though)
I'd prefer Dufty n back him in for some improvements in needed areas as I've admired his attack for a few years and he is what we are lacking (we seriously lake attacking strike in our backs)
I am.also concerned about this defensive mindset around a FB, I get the organising part but if we are relying on our FB to save the day with his defence, our front line needs an ass kicking. Plus sides like the storm will have Paps in support n no FB will stop it
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I'd prefer Dufty n back him in for some improvements in needed areas as I've admired his attack for a few years and he is what we are lacking (we seriously lake attacking strike in our backs)
I am.also concerned about this defensive mindset around a FB, I get the organising part but if we are relying on our FB to save the day with his defence, our front line needs an ass kicking. Plus sides like the storm will have Paps in support n no FB will stop it
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Last edited by Bennyinthewest on June 16, 2021, 9:45 am, edited 1 time in total.
- GreenMachine
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Whitehead to lock fast approaching the Cotric to fullback levels of fascination....I don't understand it..
Do people watch his games?
Why change what isn't broken?
Do people watch his games?
Why change what isn't broken?
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
As I said in my comment, purely to play that link role if we don't have a fullback that can pass the ball.GreenMachine wrote:Whitehead to lock fast approaching the Cotric to fullback levels of fascination....I don't understand it..
Do people watch his games?
Why change what isn't broken?
I like whitehead at 2nd row, but it's about team balance. If we have Dufty I wouldn't dream of moving him
*for the record with the cotric comparison, put me firmly in the "wingers are more important than centres now" camp n would never move him
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- Raiders_Pat
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I think for me it was more about not wanting to play a third prop at lock in this age of the game. I think there would be value in bringing in a genuine lock or a gun second rower and shifting Whitehead to lock.GreenMachine wrote: ↑June 16, 2021, 10:28 am Whitehead to lock fast approaching the Cotric to fullback levels of fascination....I don't understand it..
Do people watch his games?
Why change what isn't broken?
- GreenMachine
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I agree with the move away from a third prop...Raiders_Pat wrote: ↑June 16, 2021, 11:00 amI think for me it was more about not wanting to play a third prop at lock in this age of the game. I think there would be value in bringing in a genuine lock or a gun second rower and shifting Whitehead to lock.GreenMachine wrote: ↑June 16, 2021, 10:28 am Whitehead to lock fast approaching the Cotric to fullback levels of fascination....I don't understand it..
Do people watch his games?
Why change what isn't broken?
I don't like that we play Sutton there at all...
However, Ricky has clearly learnt something by separating Papali, Guler and Sutton...
I think Trey Mooney is earmarked to eventually be our ball playing 13....I'd like to see him get some FG experience this season, even if it is one or two games..
- gangrenous
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
It’s not all about saving the day when the line gets broken (though CNK is excellent at that). It’s also about organising the front line defence, and positioning to defend plays and kicks.Bennyinthewest wrote: I am.also concerned about this defensive mindset around a FB, I get the organising part but if we are relying on our FB to save the day with his defence, our front line needs an ass kicking. Plus sides like the storm will have Paps in support n no FB will stop it
The drop out stats for Wighton versus CNK at fullback would be chalk and cheese. The reduction in sets defending our line is huge in winning games.
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
Fullbacks defend in the front line now.Bennyinthewest wrote: ↑June 16, 2021, 9:45 am
I am.also concerned about this defensive mindset around a FB, I get the organising part but if we are relying on our FB to save the day with his defence, our front line needs an ass kicking. Plus sides like the storm will have Paps in support n no FB will stop it
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
The irony about people commenting on CNK's passing issues is it was his ball to Leilua that should have seen us leading in the 2019 GF. Beautiful ball in that instance.
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- Brett Mullins
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
The real irony is you are trying to defend his passing game and are having to go back two years to mention a decent passWiki Special wrote:The irony about people commenting on CNK's passing issues is it was his ball to Leilua that should have seen us leading in the 2019 GF. Beautiful ball in that instance.
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
I mean he has thrown a few good balls in 2 years. But it's become evident it's not developing. 7 times out of 10 the play dies with him as he can't do quick hands and panics if rushed and just hangs on/tries to step inside. It's almost painful at times.Bennyinthewest wrote: ↑June 17, 2021, 9:34 amThe real irony is you are trying to defend his passing game and are having to go back two years to mention a decent passWiki Special wrote:The irony about people commenting on CNK's passing issues is it was his ball to Leilua that should have seen us leading in the 2019 GF. Beautiful ball in that instance.
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Re: Canberra Raiders join race for Matt Dufty
And that is a really tough call because CNK does a lot of things very right and seems a fantastic club man with a huge heart so it kind of sucks, but it is the right call. CNK is very good but not elite. We can carry him if we surround him with elite players but in reality I think he is hanging on till we upgrade and that is a harsh but correct call.Botman wrote: ↑June 15, 2021, 8:23 pm The club signalling their interests in Dufty and Hynes suggests they are of the belief that they need more ball playing out of the fullback position.
Unless they land a prodigious halfback talent that can fill the creative void, hard to imagine they'll wake up and decide that's the wrong way to go.
How long CNK has that job will depend entirely on how long it takes the club to find his replacement.