Vlandysball 2022

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FuiFui BradBrad
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Vlandysball 2022

Post by FuiFui BradBrad »

Just saw this on Reddit and found it interesting.

Apparently in the NRL era, the 2021 Panthers side averaged the lowest points per game over the finals series than any other Grand Final winning team.

In this new V’Landysball era, maybe Stick’s “Sticking Solid” defensive tactics could work, if done right.

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Re: V’Landysball 2022

Post by bonehead »

they reffed the finals differently to the season and by all reports that is the expectation for 2022

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Re: V’Landysball 2022

Post by gangrenous »

As in the expectation is that they continue reffing that way, or that they’ll do the same change of officiating in season to finals?
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Re: V’Landysball 2022

Post by bonehead »

gangrenous wrote:As in the expectation is that they continue reffing that way, or that they’ll do the same change of officiating in season to finals?
that the 6 agains will be dialled back

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Re: V’Landysball 2022

Post by Toviii »

How are clubs meant to prepare for anything in this era of reactionary officiating? Melbourne were completely dominant up until a few weeks before finals and then got knocked out in a prelim by a Penrith team happy to risk jumping offside and slowing down in the ruck
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Colk »

They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by BadnMean »

Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by greeneyed »

BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am
Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Botman »

Yes, the finals were not officiated in the same way the regular rounds were
if we know that will continue, perhaps grinding it out and getting into the finals and then having a style that works for how those games will be officiated might work, awfully hard to thread that needle

Or, we can just do both, right?
We can aim to give ourselves multiple ways to win... we can be a tough, gritty defensive team, who is able to defend our line... and still use the ball expansively and attack creativity with the football.
I keep saying it because people seem to think you have to be one or the other... we're allowed to be both
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by BadnMean »

greeneyed wrote: October 8, 2021, 7:32 am
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am
Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
That only comes from removing 6 agains altogether (not gonna happen) or leaving things as is. Which is fine by me if they don't make any.

But if you want a solution that instead of adding new rules, simply uses rules already in place, then I think it's a good solution. It doesn't add complexity to the ref, only for the captain. It's no more complex than the advantage rule, which is effectively the same in spirit.
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Colk »

BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 8:05 am
greeneyed wrote: October 8, 2021, 7:32 am
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am
Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
That only comes from removing 6 agains altogether (not gonna happen) or leaving things as is. Which is fine by me if they don't make any.

But if you want a solution that instead of adding new rules, simply uses rules already in place, then I think it's a good solution. It doesn't add complexity to the ref, only for the captain. It's no more complex than the advantage rule, which is effectively the same in spirit.
If V’landy’s were to go then we would get rid of the ridiculous rule changes but yeah that’s unlikely, at least for the foreseeable future.

If 6 agains are not going to go, why not make them applicable within say 20 metres out from the try line. That prevents people deliberately giving penalties close to their try line which was the whole reason why this farce was introduced.

Another option is to either just stop the clock when the ball id not in play or add injury time like soccer if V’landerp isn’t concerned about more action. Adding injury time or stopping time etc gives more opportunity for advertising which is good for TV broadcasting rights
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by greeneyed »

BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 8:05 am
greeneyed wrote: October 8, 2021, 7:32 am
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am
Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
That only comes from removing 6 agains altogether (not gonna happen) or leaving things as is. Which is fine by me if they don't make any.

But if you want a solution that instead of adding new rules, simply uses rules already in place, then I think it's a good solution. It doesn't add complexity to the ref, only for the captain. It's no more complex than the advantage rule, which is effectively the same in spirit.
They just have to unwind rule changes. First 2021. Then 2020 if needed.
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Postman Pat »

Colk wrote:
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 8:05 am
greeneyed wrote: October 8, 2021, 7:32 am
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am
Colk wrote: October 7, 2021, 10:34 pm They just need to go back to penalties and get rid of 6 agains. If they do call 6 agains then you run risk of just doubling down on the whole momentum argument but if you don’t call out obvious penalties because you are scared of the negative impacts of implementing them then what is the point of having them?
They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
That only comes from removing 6 agains altogether (not gonna happen) or leaving things as is. Which is fine by me if they don't make any.

But if you want a solution that instead of adding new rules, simply uses rules already in place, then I think it's a good solution. It doesn't add complexity to the ref, only for the captain. It's no more complex than the advantage rule, which is effectively the same in spirit.
If V’landy’s were to go then we would get rid of the ridiculous rule changes but yeah that’s unlikely, at least for the foreseeable future.

If 6 agains are not going to go, why not make them applicable within say 20 metres out from the try line. That prevents people deliberately giving penalties close to their try line which was the whole reason why this farce was introduced.

Another option is to either just stop the clock when the ball id not in play or add injury time like soccer if V’landerp isn’t concerned about more action. Adding injury time or stopping time etc gives more opportunity for advertising which is good for TV broadcasting rights
I agree if they stopped the 6 agains inside the attacking teams 20 it would fix the rule pretty quickly, I don’t mind the rule in general but the early tackle count 6 again on the line give nothing to the team with ball in hand.
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Colk »

Postman Pat wrote: October 8, 2021, 9:34 pm
Colk wrote:
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 8:05 am
greeneyed wrote: October 8, 2021, 7:32 am
BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2021, 5:55 am

They could just adjust the existing captains challenge so the team that got infringed against can "challenge" the 6 again and get a penalty instead. So the refs don't have to make any extra decisions and the team with the ball gets to decide if they like their roll on or want to kick for yards/goal.
Simplicity, not more complexity, is needed.
That only comes from removing 6 agains altogether (not gonna happen) or leaving things as is. Which is fine by me if they don't make any.

But if you want a solution that instead of adding new rules, simply uses rules already in place, then I think it's a good solution. It doesn't add complexity to the ref, only for the captain. It's no more complex than the advantage rule, which is effectively the same in spirit.
If V’landy’s were to go then we would get rid of the ridiculous rule changes but yeah that’s unlikely, at least for the foreseeable future.

If 6 agains are not going to go, why not make them applicable within say 20 metres out from the try line. That prevents people deliberately giving penalties close to their try line which was the whole reason why this farce was introduced.

Another option is to either just stop the clock when the ball id not in play or add injury time like soccer if V’landerp isn’t concerned about more action. Adding injury time or stopping time etc gives more opportunity for advertising which is good for TV broadcasting rights
I agree if they stopped the 6 agains inside the attacking teams 20 it would fix the rule pretty quickly, I don’t mind the rule in general but the early tackle count 6 again on the line give nothing to the team with ball in hand.
Exactly. If you are attacking the line then a 6 again is what you want. If you are inside your own half you want a penalty. The problem with the 6 again is you give heaps of them then the game becomes too quick and too open and it becomes like touch football. If you don’t give them then you have teams flouting the rules.

Instead of just policing the ruck better with harsher penalties for chicken wings and other wrestling tactics or If they wanted to introduce more fatigue (I’m guessing the sport wasn’t hard enough on players) reduce interchanges, they created a solution to a non existent problem
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Re: Vlandysball 2022

Post by Seiffert82 »

I've been banging on about this all season.

The focus on having 5 ball players in the team, including at lock, with less emphasis on defence is a fools paradise IMO.

The best defence and kicking game will always be the foundation of success. Penrith scored 6 tries in 4 games through the finals series and won the comp.

Whether or not the NRL have stated how the game will be reffed next season, we are always going to go back to a game that is more balanced. The 6 again crapshoot was starting to get ridiculous.

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