Sacrilege...Fuifui Bradbrad wrote:Ad hominem, is that when you make comments about the quality of your mothers spaghetti?
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Sacrilege...Fuifui Bradbrad wrote:Ad hominem, is that when you make comments about the quality of your mothers spaghetti?
All things on earth have a temperature.dubby wrote:Gangers, all media is leaning one way or another. Some are just less discreet about it.
I think the lesson was learned. I don’t doubt the whole world would be in Ukraine now if nuclear weapons didn’t exist.dubby wrote:I think you're right to a point, gangers. Britain and France did nothing while Hitler did precisely the same thing: reclaiming what he thought was rightfully German land.
The US public did not want to enter a war.
The lesson we learned from that is appeasement makes the aggressor more aggressive.
Which leads to its own problems… what do you think Putin will resort to if it looks like a ‘inferior ’ non-country is outmanoeuvring how own?Botman wrote: ↑February 27, 2022, 4:14 pm It’s pretty bloody inspiring to see the citizenry of Ukraine band together like this and hold their ground against a much bigger army
Russia very clearly did not anticipate this level of resilience. The longer this goes on without them capturing Kyiv the more embarrassing it looks.
I’ve seen some military experts on various platforms saying this is actually exposing how poor the Russian military is and despite its size, it’s a poorly trained and lead group with terrible planning and logistics
Don’t know anything about that myself but if accurate this could indeed get very embarrassing for Putin
Yep, reports emerging that Putin is very pissed off about how this is all going, and now he's being cut off from quite literally his War Chest, which he was saving to get the country through economic sanctionsCoastalraider wrote: ↑February 27, 2022, 5:03 pmWhich leads to its own problems… what do you think Putin will resort to if it looks like a ‘inferior ’ non-country is outmanoeuvring how own?Botman wrote: ↑February 27, 2022, 4:14 pm It’s pretty bloody inspiring to see the citizenry of Ukraine band together like this and hold their ground against a much bigger army
Russia very clearly did not anticipate this level of resilience. The longer this goes on without them capturing Kyiv the more embarrassing it looks.
I’ve seen some military experts on various platforms saying this is actually exposing how poor the Russian military is and despite its size, it’s a poorly trained and lead group with terrible planning and logistics
Don’t know anything about that myself but if accurate this could indeed get very embarrassing for Putin
Yeah I’ve been reading the updates lately, and have been pretty inspired. Never thought I would ever learn about Asymmetric Warfare before this weekend.Botman wrote:It’s pretty bloody inspiring to see the citizenry of Ukraine band together like this and hold their ground against a much bigger army
Russia very clearly did not anticipate this level of resilience. The longer this goes on without them capturing Kyiv the more embarrassing it looks.
I’ve seen some military experts on various platforms saying this is actually exposing how poor the Russian military is and despite its size, it’s a poorly trained and lead group with terrible planning and logistics
Don’t know anything about that myself but if accurate this could indeed get very embarrassing for Putin
That's the big one. Whatever end game he had in mind would be totally out the window now. I don't see any favourable outcome for him. Scary thing is how much he wants to take down with him.Mickey_Raider wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 8:15 am Notwithstanding that the defiance from Ukraine is inspirational, I think that the quick conclusions that Putins campaign is failing because he hasn’t taken Ukraine within a few hours is just a bit of a coping mechanism to be honest.
Ukraine has the 3rd largest army in Europe.
By comparison it took Hitler 6 weeks to occupy Poland.
I don’t think there is all that much doubt amongst strategists that Russia will be able to gain some semblance of control over Ukraine, probably sooner rather than later.
The main question really is for how long, in what capacity, and to what end?
I'm certainly no expert but I don't think anyone believes the Russian's wont eventually overcome the Ukrainian's the disparity in resources, both human and munitions seems insurmountable to me just looking at it.Mickey_Raider wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 8:15 am Notwithstanding that the defiance from Ukraine is inspirational, I think that the quick conclusions that Putins campaign is failing because he hasn’t taken Ukraine within a few hours is just a bit of a coping mechanism to be honest.
Ukraine has the 3rd largest army in Europe.
By comparison it took Hitler 6 weeks to occupy Poland.
I don’t think there is all that much doubt amongst strategists that Russia will be able to gain some semblance of control over Ukraine, probably sooner rather than later.
The main question really is for how long, in what capacity, and to what end?
Might be more of a top down revolution to depose Putin. The ones hardest hit by these sanctions will be the oligarchs. As they see their assets being frozen and wealth greatly diminish they will become far less enthusiastic about supporting any claim to eastern Ukraine. Even it it was successful they would have nothing to show for it. Might see them collaborate to throw Putin under the bus and replace him with somebody who can maybe repair some damage.Botman wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 9:01 amI'm certainly no expert but I don't think anyone believes the Russian's wont eventually overcome the Ukrainian's the disparity in resources, both human and munitions seems insurmountable to me just looking at it.Mickey_Raider wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 8:15 am Notwithstanding that the defiance from Ukraine is inspirational, I think that the quick conclusions that Putins campaign is failing because he hasn’t taken Ukraine within a few hours is just a bit of a coping mechanism to be honest.
Ukraine has the 3rd largest army in Europe.
By comparison it took Hitler 6 weeks to occupy Poland.
I don’t think there is all that much doubt amongst strategists that Russia will be able to gain some semblance of control over Ukraine, probably sooner rather than later.
The main question really is for how long, in what capacity, and to what end?
Russia will eventually take Ukraine and as you say, probably sooner than later. But the experts across platforms I'm seeing are pretty adamant this is not going very well for Russia and so far it's been a failure, heavy emphasis on "so far".
What is interesting is what happens back at home for Russia, the sanctions are coming down, the people will start hurting. A lot of them don't want this war, and now it's not going quite the way they wanted and suddenly Russian mothers are going to be losing more son's than they anticipated. And the looming nuclear threat... there is quite a recipe for large scale unrest from the citizens of Russia brewing here.
That sort of stuff ultimately comes down to the people and the nature of the occupation.Sid wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 2:08 pm Hypothetically down the track if after the Oligarchs overthrow the current Ukrainian government and inserts their puppet government, I guess the legitimacy of the new Ukrainian government would have the world divided, particularly after any number of "elections" take place? Putting pressure on NATO to relieve sanctions to Russia and the new Ukrainian government/s. I guess what I mean is that Putin and the Oligarchs may be aware the original puppet government isn't going to be widely accepted, other than by the current countries that don't have sanctions on Russia, but after "elections" whether it's the same face or possibly even 1 or 2 fresh new faces being "elected", at what point will it be widely accepted that a new Ukrainian government would be legitimate? What measures would need to happen for NATO to relieve pressure on the sanctions?
Edit: I guess it's pretty difficult to draw conclusions/try and accurately answer any number of hypotheticals of what's going to happen from here.
Been a bit of thinking on this I see.Sid wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 2:08 pm Hypothetically down the track if after the Oligarchs overthrow the current Ukrainian government and inserts their puppet government, I guess the legitimacy of the new Ukrainian government would have the world divided, particularly after any number of "elections" take place? Putting pressure on NATO to relieve sanctions to Russia and the new Ukrainian government/s. I guess what I mean is that Putin and the Oligarchs may be aware the original puppet government isn't going to be widely accepted, other than by the current countries that don't have sanctions on Russia, but after "elections" whether it's the same face or possibly even 1 or 2 fresh new faces being "elected", at what point will it be widely accepted that a new Ukrainian government would be legitimate? What measures would need to happen for NATO to relieve pressure on the sanctions?
Edit: I guess it's pretty difficult to draw conclusions/try and accurately answer any number of hypotheticals of what's going to happen from here.
Over the weekend was a bit guilty of doomscrolling and overthinking scenarios of how this Ukrainian crisis plays out tbh. Started self banning myself from checking the news/socials so oftenNorthern Raider wrote:Been a bit of thinking on this I see.Sid wrote: ↑February 28, 2022, 2:08 pm Hypothetically down the track if after the Oligarchs overthrow the current Ukrainian government and inserts their puppet government, I guess the legitimacy of the new Ukrainian government would have the world divided, particularly after any number of "elections" take place? Putting pressure on NATO to relieve sanctions to Russia and the new Ukrainian government/s. I guess what I mean is that Putin and the Oligarchs may be aware the original puppet government isn't going to be widely accepted, other than by the current countries that don't have sanctions on Russia, but after "elections" whether it's the same face or possibly even 1 or 2 fresh new faces being "elected", at what point will it be widely accepted that a new Ukrainian government would be legitimate? What measures would need to happen for NATO to relieve pressure on the sanctions?
Edit: I guess it's pretty difficult to draw conclusions/try and accurately answer any number of hypotheticals of what's going to happen from here.
Don’t go holding your breath there my good man.Botman wrote: i said i wanted conservative **** to do BETTER
Name calling, even my 8 year old daughter has moved on from that. God this forum can be embarrassing at times…dubby wrote:Could always go by his masculine middle name; Robinette