2023 Rd 14 v Tigers: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

[Raidernation]

The only take away from Savage not getting picked is he hasn't done enough in training and in first grade to merit the spot. The Stuart doesn't bring through young players crowd is nonsense, look at the team and how many players he has brought through. The Xavier performs in firsts crowd must admit his last game was almost 9 months ago. He clearly isn't playing well in NSW cup but more important than that he clearly isn't showing it in training. Stuart clearly rates how players train above performances in reserve grade and savage isn't there. Stuart clearly sees something in him because he played him, re signed him and handed the fullback spot to him this year prior to the injury. For me Savage is the typical raiders player prior to Stuart who had oodles of hype, was going to be the best player in the league and thus had a saloon pass into firsts. They would get a pass for poor performances because their learning and got upgrades before they were ready because we were scared they would leave and we were never close to being a challenger. Ryan Papenhuyzen is a perfect example of a player who wasnt getting it done in training despite his speed and Bellamy tried to get rid of him, noone wanted him and he changed his mentality and worked for it and made it. Perhaps Savage is getting the same treatment.

[Finchy]

The Xavier performs in firsts crowd must admit his last game was almost 9 months ago.

I refuse to admit this. He played firsts a few weeks ago vs Bulldogs.

[-TW-]

The Xavier performs in firsts crowd must admit his last game was almost 9 months ago.

I refuse to admit this. He played firsts a few weeks ago vs Bulldogs.

It's been a long month but that's just taking the piss

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[Raidernation]

I should have said at fullback was 9 months ago.

[dubby]

Savage played on the wing not long ago! Against the Broncos

[-TW-]

Bulldogs*

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[Roger Kenworthy]

I'm intrigued to see how Frawley is going to be used although I'll be stunned if he plays more than 10 minutes barring an injury to a back.

Fingers crossed for the 3 hooker rotation. Woolford to start, Starling on at 30. Frawley on at 50. Wrestle on the sideline at 70 to see who plays the last 10.

That would probably be our most strategic approach to a game in awhile.

[Boomercm]

Frawley is a career plodder who makes the most of a very limited skill set. I have some admiration for him, but he's not good. He is a great asset to guide the young players coming through in reggies, but he should never be near the first grade side while ever we have an alternate reasonable option such as Schneider.

[Canberra Milk]

Nice theories about Savage off the field but I think it's just as likely, if not more, that Stuart wants to see him "dig in", do the hard carries etc... essentially change how he plays on the field, rather than needing to explain it by what he does off it

Stuart also likes a certain type of personality off the field, too. Some of his favourites, Whitehead, Gallen, Hodgson, Morley, "men's men" who work hard and play hard (and probably drink hard). Hudson Young said Sticky told him how you are off the field, reflects how you are on it. So it would make sense. Wants you to be one of the boys, not a shy guy on the periphery

So yeah nice theories but in all likelihood he's just not a Stuart type player, and not a Stuart type bloke

[Seiffert82]

Xavier Savage is far from shy.

Very much doubt Croker is a massive pisshead too or Josh Papalii just quietly. Josh uses hand moisturizer. Somehow they snuck through the theoretical "man's man" gate. Sia Soliola could put on a big hit but also does a huge amount of charity work. Maybe he's not a man's man, but he could definitely be classified as a man.

Jack Wighton is definitely a man's man though. Likes a drink and a box with the punters.

Tom Starling is short, but he *allegedly* does drink and fights bouncers and police officers. Matt Timoko seems to be a nice guy, but does make good post contact metres.

Hmm, such a mixed bag of evidence.

[VictorTheViking]

So what the hell was the point of Savage learning his craft last season? All the errors we had to suffer through were for nothing….

If you recall, Stuart was reluctant to bring Savage up to first grade last year despite everyone screaming 'X' factor. Give me a break. Nothing I've seen of Savage so far makes me doubt Stuart's decision making. Kris is doing great at FB. Lets keep him there.

His defensive positioning at times is incredibly poor, but apart from that he's been solid, not a game breaker though

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[Canberra Milk]

Xavier Savage is far from shy.

Very much doubt Croker is a massive pisshead too or Josh Papalii just quietly. Josh uses hand moisturizer. Somehow they snuck through the theoretical "man's man" gate. Sia Soliola could put on a big hit but also does a huge amount of charity work. Maybe he's not a man's man, but he could definitely be classified as a man.

Jack Wighton is definitely a man's man though. Likes a drink and a box with the punters.

Hmm, such a mixed bag of evidence.

I heard Sticky used to thrash Croker. I mean it was just some punter who told me that years ago, but he was an old dude who was involved in footy at the grassroots level etc, so maybe he knew someone who knew someone.... Anyway maybe it's part of why I developed this idea of Sticky as a bit of a "drill sergeant". He'll try to thrash you, and if you pass the test, he'll reward you. If not, see ya. I concede I'm speculating at this point. I don't know Savage's personality tbh but he comes across as boyish to me. Not in a bad way at all but just not a man's man

[-TW-]

So what the hell was the point of Savage learning his craft last season? All the errors we had to suffer through were for nothing….

If you recall, Stuart was reluctant to bring Savage up to first grade last year despite everyone screaming 'X' factor. Give me a break. Nothing I've seen of Savage so far makes me doubt Stuart's decision making. Kris is doing great at FB. Lets keep him there.

His defensive positioning at times is incredibly poor, but apart from that he's been solid, not a game breaker though

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This is what it is, there's no vendettas or any other **** people like to pedal.

He'd have been set boxes to tick when he came back from injury, he hasn't, hence why he's not next in line.

If there was vendettas he'd be left to rot in reserve grade, not 18th man

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[papabear]

Frawley is a career plodder who makes the most of a very limited skill set. I have some admiration for him, but he's not good. He is a great asset to guide the young players coming through in reggies, but he should never be near the first grade side while ever we have an alternate reasonable option such as Schneider.

frawley is a better half then schnieder, he has a better kicking game, better awareness of when to pass/run and when to pass.

I cant remember schnieder ever setting up a try and he is a half.

If schnieder switched to a lock maybe.

[papabear]

if we lose this game it is on the coach - given how tight the comp is this year I dead set can not see how Xavier savage is not getting a run ahead of HSS its absolutely ridiculous.

HSS was hyped on here, I watched him closely and he was average at best. Now he is in pretty much the most important position in the game for us, whilst savage is forgotten about. Also if you are just going for a big crowd, losing to the tigers aint going to help the crowd situation.

[BadnMean]

Frawley is a career plodder who makes the most of a very limited skill set. I have some admiration for him, but he's not good. He is a great asset to guide the young players coming through in reggies, but he should never be near the first grade side while ever we have an alternate reasonable option such as Schneider.

frawley is a better half then schnieder, he has a better kicking game, better awareness of when to pass/run and when to pass.

I cant remember schnieder ever setting up a try and he is a half.

If schnieder switched to a lock maybe.

Little bit unfair on Schneider. He's been providing regular try assists in reggies, about one per game which is pretty good going for a half. He's improved that.

I've said it a million times but why would you want a small, slow lock without a proven motor?

If you want a small lock who can pass a bit- play Puru. Schneider is a half or bust in NRL for mine, nowhere near the athleticism required of a lock of that size. Tonguey at least was in the Puru mould, xippy and a workaholic.

[Bulldog]

If you want a small lock who can pass a bit- play Puru. Schneider is a half or bust in NRL for mine, nowhere near the athleticism required of a lock of that size. Tonguey at least was in the Puru mould, xippy and a workaholic.

I agree - a half or bust. I can't see Schneider at lock; not without some significant gym time.

[-PJ-]

if we lose this game it is on the coach - given how tight the comp is this year I dead set can not see how Xavier savage is not getting a run ahead of HSS its absolutely ridiculous.

HSS was hyped on here, I watched him closely and he was average at best. Now he is in pretty much the most important position in the game for us, whilst savage is forgotten about. Also if you are just going for a big crowd, losing to the tigers aint going to help the crowd situation.

Hey papa, hope yr well.

HSS has been named as Sebs replacement in the squad only, he won’t be playing fullback…fingers crossed.

[samvucago]

Frawley is a career plodder who makes the most of a very limited skill set. I have some admiration for him, but he's not good. He is a great asset to guide the young players coming through in reggies, but he should never be near the first grade side while ever we have an alternate reasonable option such as Schneider.

Hi Mrs Schneider
Hope you are doing well
Cheers

[Seiffert82]

Interesting point about Schneider. He's a good defender and certainly has some ball playing ability but is perhaps a bit slow to be a great running half.

He's got the build to be a decent lock and can defend with some physicality. I'm not sure why that wouldn't be a consideration.

I really like the idea of Puru at 9.

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[BlameItOnTheBooger]

Maybe Stick, in not picking Xavier, is just sick of clenching his cheeks every time his fullback has the ball in his own half (and the inevitability of him being driven back 10 metres or over the sideline or losing the ball. Or all 3 in the one play )

[dubby]

Bulldogs*

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D'oh!

Thanks TW

[Botman]

If you want a small lock who can pass a bit- play Puru. Schneider is a half or bust in NRL for mine, nowhere near the athleticism required of a lock of that size. Tonguey at least was in the Puru mould, xippy and a workaholic.

I agree - a half or bust. I can't see Schneider at lock; not without some significant gym time.

As I see it, it’s try to change positions or bust, because if it’s half or bust… we’re already there as a long term viable nrl half and it’s bust imo

[BadnMean]

If you want a small lock who can pass a bit- play Puru. Schneider is a half or bust in NRL for mine, nowhere near the athleticism required of a lock of that size. Tonguey at least was in the Puru mould, xippy and a workaholic.

I agree - a half or bust. I can't see Schneider at lock; not without some significant gym time.

As I see it, it’s try to change positions or bust, because if it’s half or bust… we’re already there as a long term viable nrl half and it’s bust imo

Any young player should/could be aiming to be better than the current incumbent. Especially if that incumbent is Fogarty. Who is solid but unspectacular and certainly not in the top third in his position.

[BadnMean]

Maybe Stick, in not picking Xavier, is just sick of clenching his cheeks every time his fullback has the ball in his own half (and the inevitability of him being driven back 10 metres or over the sideline or losing the ball. Or all 3 in the one play )

Xav this season makes errors at about .33 per game more than Kris... More for sure. But more significant than the following?

Kris has the most try causes in the entire NRL... (where we see the poor kick defence, rather than as errors)

Xav is scoring tries at double the rate of kris. Breaking the line at double the rate... better tackle % (just)...


But Xav is playing terrible in reggies and Kris is going so much better?

If you're going to make a point, consider the counter. As I've said ad nauseam. I see Gutho, Papenhuyzen, Slater, Walsh, kennedy driven back on the regular. There's more than the brute force way to play FB, you need to consider play style and team balance. We are slow as a wet week and not very creative, in my view Savage is the better FB defensively and in attack and a better balance for the team.

Kris' style is better suited to centre, where he'd also be good and still give just as much to the team.

[gangrenous]

I’m stunned that so many people are against Savage on what he brings to the team. Baffles me.

The only reason that I think could be justified is off field attitude. But apart from S82s anecdote that’s the first smoke I’ve seen on that front.

Occam’s razor on what we see as fans is Ricky making a bad call.

[Botman]

The only reason that I think could be justified is off field attitude. But apart from S82s anecdote that’s the first smoke I’ve seen on that front.

Yep, the only thing I’ve seen or heard on this are unsubstantiated claims from a couple of posters on this site.

If he wasn’t putting in mon-fri off the field, give the fans clamouring for him, you can bet Stuart’s mouthpieces on NRL 360 would have been making that known.

[Ultima]

Sigh... HSS...