Ethan Sanders signs three year deal with Canberra Raiders

[Colk]

Sanders could go out next week, tear an ACL and circumstances off that may see him never be in position to accept this kind of money and opportunity again

The raiders are offering a fast pass to FG football and a chunk of money that will alter the course of his life even if he never succeeds at the highest levels of football

That’s a tough offer to pass up

He could very well. But there are degrees of chance here.

It’s a fair point though, careers don’t always go to plan. I’m pretty sure Joel Cain didn’t have Sportsbet in mind when he declared he wanted a career in media

To be fair Joel Caine is doing well for himself considering he wasn’t particularly memorable as a player

[Billy Walker]

Sanders could go out next week, tear an ACL and circumstances off that may see him never be in position to accept this kind of money and opportunity again

The raiders are offering a fast pass to FG football and a chunk of money that will alter the course of his life even if he never succeeds at the highest levels of football

That’s a tough offer to pass up

He could very well. But there are degrees of chance here.

It’s a fair point though, careers don’t always go to plan. I’m pretty sure Joel Cain didn’t have Sportsbet in mind when he declared he wanted a career in media

To be fair Joel Caine is doing well for himself considering he wasn’t particularly memorable as a player

He’s even less memorable as an annoying odds monkey. It was probably that or washing windscreens for him so fair point.

[Bluesbrother]

Nope, he could still stay at the Eels or go elsewhere. Or the club could decide to stick with Fog. Doubt any of that happens though.

Never say never on the first. Maybe not with the Eels but somebody could offer him advice and say don’t go to the Raiders because they are a basketcase etc. The Panthers would be a good fit for him atm. If you really wanted to develop as a player than there would be no better option than learning from Cleary.

Nobody is advising a junior player that the Raiders are a basket case. Players are told the Raiders have one of the best systems in the league. Thats why they are able to sign them.

Mate look ahead. What is our side going to look like in two years time and would you advise your client to go to a club which doesn’t look like it is on the up (let’s be honest)

Our forward pack besides Tapine is probably on the wane (depends on whether Ata and Trey Mooney progress). You have no other spine players with any considerable experience at this stage (assuming that Chevy and Ethan Strange). You have one good outside back in Timoko and you can’t really bet on anybody else - I have some raps on Asomua and Savage but one hasn’t played first grade yet and one is inconsistent.

You have to project these things forward sometimes. I could go through a whole bunch of other sides who look a whole lot closer to a premiership. That to me looks like a bad situation to be coming into.

Who are the other sides Nostradamus?

[Botman]

Joel Caine's year on year growth in that role is remarkable.
In awe at the sheer size of the lad. Absolute unit

[bonehead]

Joel Caine's year on year growth in that role is remarkable.
In awe at the sheer size of the lad. Absolute unit

Joel Caine has a fairly decent career on SEN radio

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[Rickmando]

Joel Caine's year on year growth in that role is remarkable.
In awe at the sheer size of the lad. Absolute unit

It’s not just the odds that Joel finds tasty

[nachopants]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

[Seiffert82]

I just want to get this thread to 1000 posts before the kid is able to sign a contract.

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[Bluesbrother]

Nope, he could still stay at the Eels or go elsewhere. Or the club could decide to stick with Fog. Doubt any of that happens though.

Never say never on the first. Maybe not with the Eels but somebody could offer him advice and say don’t go to the Raiders because they are a basketcase etc. The Panthers would be a good fit for him atm. If you really wanted to develop as a player than there would be no better option than learning from Cleary.

Nobody is advising a junior player that the Raiders are a basket case. Players are told the Raiders have one of the best systems in the league. Thats why they are able to sign them.

Mate look ahead. What is our side going to look like in two years time and would you advise your client to go to a club which doesn’t look like it is on the up (let’s be honest)

Our forward pack besides Tapine is probably on the wane (depends on whether Ata and Trey Mooney progress). You have no other spine players with any considerable experience at this stage (assuming that Chevy and Ethan Strange). You have one good outside back in Timoko and you can’t really bet on anybody else - I have some raps on Asomua and Savage but one hasn’t played first grade yet and one is inconsistent.

You have to project these things forward sometimes. I could go through a whole bunch of other sides who look a whole lot closer to a premiership. That to me looks like a bad situation to be coming into.

Who are the other sides Nostradamus?

Crickets....

[Botman]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

Just stuff you hear around the traps... but you're a bit niave if you think he's coming here for peanuts.
There is a reason the club is very confident he's coming and that's probably because they've made an offer he cant possibly refuse.

[Colk]

Never say never on the first. Maybe not with the Eels but somebody could offer him advice and say don’t go to the Raiders because they are a basketcase etc. The Panthers would be a good fit for him atm. If you really wanted to develop as a player than there would be no better option than learning from Cleary.

Nobody is advising a junior player that the Raiders are a basket case. Players are told the Raiders have one of the best systems in the league. Thats why they are able to sign them.

Mate look ahead. What is our side going to look like in two years time and would you advise your client to go to a club which doesn’t look like it is on the up (let’s be honest)

Our forward pack besides Tapine is probably on the wane (depends on whether Ata and Trey Mooney progress). You have no other spine players with any considerable experience at this stage (assuming that Chevy and Ethan Strange). You have one good outside back in Timoko and you can’t really bet on anybody else - I have some raps on Asomua and Savage but one hasn’t played first grade yet and one is inconsistent.

You have to project these things forward sometimes. I could go through a whole bunch of other sides who look a whole lot closer to a premiership. That to me looks like a bad situation to be coming into.

Who are the other sides Nostradamus?

Crickets....

I don’t feel the need to repeat myself - I have already answered this question.

Go look on the third page of the Canberra vs Eels teams thread.

[Mickey_Raider]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

Just stuff you hear around the traps... but you're a bit niave if you think he's coming here for peanuts.
There is a reason the club is very confident he's coming and that's probably because they've made an offer he cant possibly refuse.

I was told 550k from someone purporting to know. I asked point blank whether that was opinion or he knew for a fact and he said it was the latter.

Could have been bs of course but it was a pretty specific thing in the context of the conversation to be bs-ING about.

Also kind of just makes sense. An offer on the order of that amount is probably about what is required to uproot a young talent like that from Sydney.

[Botman]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

Just stuff you hear around the traps... but you're a bit niave if you think he's coming here for peanuts.
There is a reason the club is very confident he's coming and that's probably because they've made an offer he cant possibly refuse.

I was told 550k from someone purporting to know. I asked point blank whether that was opinion or he knew for a fact and he said it was the latter.

Right in line with what i've been told by a few different people.
One said exactly that figure and the other left it at 500k+

[Coastalraider]

Just for **** and giggles should we get out the ramp in here, and see how long it takes Fox staff writers to report we are offering $750k?

[Rick]

$550k from 2025 seems ok. By that time he would have had a full year of NSW Cup under his belt.

On the other hand that is a lot of money for a guy if he is not in the 17. How long was the deal rumoured to be?


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[NoMan]

Originally reported as 2 years. Might've been 3 if he came early.

[Seiffert82]

I think we should sign him.

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[nachopants]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

Just stuff you hear around the traps... but you're a bit niave if you think he's coming here for peanuts.
There is a reason the club is very confident he's coming and that's probably because they've made an offer he cant possibly refuse.

No I know that, but we're talking about $600k for Fogarty right.

Is Sanders rolling in on $850k or .... $450k or .... I mean .... everyone's talking smack about it (god that makes me sound young and cool) but what is the number we're talking about?

Moses is on $1.25m

We let Schneider go and he'll be at Penrith on less than $500k we suspect if not award-ish rates or $250k.

So... what's this massive Sanders salary and for how many years?

[greeneyed]

What is this "massive amount of money" rhetoric that we are accepting as fact though? What's the story there?

Just stuff you hear around the traps... but you're a bit niave if you think he's coming here for peanuts.
There is a reason the club is very confident he's coming and that's probably because they've made an offer he cant possibly refuse.

No I know that, but we're talking about $600k for Fogarty right.

Is Sanders rolling in on $850k or .... $450k or .... I mean .... everyone's talking smack about it (god that makes me sound young and cool) but what is the number we're talking about?

Moses is on $1.25m

We let Schneider go and he'll be at Penrith on less than $500k we suspect if not award-ish rates or $250k.

So... what's this massive Sanders salary and for how many years?

See above… a couple of posters saying $550k. Who knows if it’s correct? I wouldn’t be in the slightest bit surprised though.

[Seiffert82]

Could be correct. Who knows?

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[Bluesbrother]

Nobody is advising a junior player that the Raiders are a basket case. Players are told the Raiders have one of the best systems in the league. Thats why they are able to sign them.

Mate look ahead. What is our side going to look like in two years time and would you advise your client to go to a club which doesn’t look like it is on the up (let’s be honest)

Our forward pack besides Tapine is probably on the wane (depends on whether Ata and Trey Mooney progress). You have no other spine players with any considerable experience at this stage (assuming that Chevy and Ethan Strange). You have one good outside back in Timoko and you can’t really bet on anybody else - I have some raps on Asomua and Savage but one hasn’t played first grade yet and one is inconsistent.

You have to project these things forward sometimes. I could go through a whole bunch of other sides who look a whole lot closer to a premiership. That to me looks like a bad situation to be coming into.

Who are the other sides Nostradamus?

Crickets....

I don’t feel the need to repeat myself - I have already answered this question.

Go look on the third page of the Canberra vs Eels teams thread.

Coming in pontificating like you're the gospel on Rugby League yet you can't support your claims.

Looking across the league our prospective talent is of higher quality and deeper than most.

We've got elite players coming through in 1, 6, 7. Our middle rotation is immense and our centre pairing has another 5+ years of prime football. Wingers of Savage and Asomua.

Aside from a glaring weakness at 9 we are quite stacked. Put us up against any other team and we're competing.

Panthers have elite players coming through, as do the Storm and Roosters. Aside from that though, we're up there. We're in a position to be very competitive over the next decade.

I'll throw it out there and say one of Strange, Stewart or Sanders will be playing origin in the next 5 years.

We need to sign or develop a 9 and an elite edge backrower. Which the club knows and has the cash to do so it will happen.

Get better Colk.

[Seiffert82]

Let's hope Stewart is the goods. He doesn't have that explosive speed of the elite fullbacks in the comp, but he is a smart ballplayer and seems to read the game well.

It will be a very different looking attack with a player like him in the side. I think it works if you have power and speed on the wings, with the likes of Savage and Asomua.

Hopefully we eventually see a nice combo with the kicking game of Sanders and running game of Strange.

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[Seiffert82]

Unless he stays at the Eels.

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[Colk]

Mate look ahead. What is our side going to look like in two years time and would you advise your client to go to a club which doesn’t look like it is on the up (let’s be honest)

Our forward pack besides Tapine is probably on the wane (depends on whether Ata and Trey Mooney progress). You have no other spine players with any considerable experience at this stage (assuming that Chevy and Ethan Strange). You have one good outside back in Timoko and you can’t really bet on anybody else - I have some raps on Asomua and Savage but one hasn’t played first grade yet and one is inconsistent.

You have to project these things forward sometimes. I could go through a whole bunch of other sides who look a whole lot closer to a premiership. That to me looks like a bad situation to be coming into.

Who are the other sides Nostradamus?

Crickets....

I don’t feel the need to repeat myself - I have already answered this question.

Go look on the third page of the Canberra vs Eels teams thread.

Coming in pontificating like you're the gospel on Rugby League yet you can't support your claims.

Looking across the league our prospective talent is of higher quality and deeper than most.

We've got elite players coming through in 1, 6, 7. Our middle rotation is immense and our centre pairing has another 5+ years of prime football. Wingers of Savage and Asomua.

Aside from a glaring weakness at 9 we are quite stacked. Put us up against any other team and we're competing.

Panthers have elite players coming through, as do the Storm and Roosters. Aside from that though, we're up there. We're in a position to be very competitive over the next decade.

I'll throw it out there and say one of Strange, Stewart or Sanders will be playing origin in the next 5 years.

We need to sign or develop a 9 and an elite edge backrower. Which the club knows and has the cash to do so it will happen.

Get better Colk.

Elite players at 1, 6 and 7? What are you smoking?

If you’re talking about Sanders and Stewart as two of those players then they haven’t even played first grade yet. Way too early to talk them up. They are talented yes but heck there are a whole bunch of players in junior systems who are talented and a lot of those talented players just don’t make it for a variety of reasons.

Brett Firman was supposed to be the next great halfback at one time. What about Ash Taylor? What about Jack Cogger? What about Jordan Rankin who made his debut when he was 16.

There are countless examples of blokes who don’t become the players that people expect them to and I bet you any money that there would have been blokes like you saying on some forum back then that this bloke was going to be an Origin player blah blah.

The other thing too is when was the last great spine player that we have developed and furthermore what are the realistic chances of a bloke coming into first grade and immediately dominating in a spine position and winning games off the bat which Sanders, Stewart and Strange (to a lesser extent) will have to do considering there is no seniority in those positions (well that is what people are suggesting on here). You can rack your brain if you want but most players that make it, particularly halves, are brought up amongst other experienced halves until they mature. Cleary is a prime example: he spent his first three or four years of first grade playing alongside senior players like Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace and James Maloney. Some of them aren’t great but the point is there was no pressure on him to deliver until he was experienced enough to do so.

I agree with you on our middle rotation. That is very good although it needs less Guler and Saulo to be elite.

We have one elite centre in Timoko who could become the best centre in the game. Kris on the other hand is pretty average and there are plenty of better centres than him.

We need a back or two (hopefully they can be developed in house) and we need probably two backrowers (although Noah Martin has promise to be one). We also desperately need a good 9.

Overall we are in the bottom half in terms of first grade talent if we are being honest. There is some promise in certain areas but every side in the competition has a better spine than us. Most teams have better edge backrowers than us as well. Our backline sans Timoko is pretty average as well.

[Colk]

Let's hope Stewart is the goods. He doesn't have that explosive speed of the elite fullbacks in the comp, but he is a smart ballplayer and seems to read the game well.

It will be a very different looking attack with a player like him in the side. I think it works if you have power and speed on the wings, with the likes of Savage and Asomua.

Hopefully we eventually see a nice combo with the kicking game of Sanders and running game of Strange.

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That is my concern with Stewart. He looks a good footballer but as an athlete I’m not sure. He doesn’t have the explosive speed of a Walsh or a Ponga or a few others. It is why I am not so sure he is going to be a great player. He will have the smarts to be a good dependable fullback but his lack of size and relative pace might limit him.

[FROG]

I disagree colk. You point to our lack of star power as an indication that our future is bleak, and dismiss the prospect that we have 3 of the most promising junior spine players in our roster as any sign we will improve. Presumably you think the club should have signed better, experienced players, but I think the clubs approach to sign fringe first graders desperate for an opportunity is the right one. The club seems to have made a habit of signing hard workers (Hosking, Smithies etc) and I am confident this will pay off. So while there are risks, I don't accept that we are on the decline, far from it. I think the next 5 years could be the start of something very special

[-PJ-]

I disagree colk. You point to our lack of star power as an indication that our future is bleak, and dismiss the prospect that we have 3 of the most promising junior spine players in our roster as any sign we will improve. Presumably you think the club should have signed better, experienced players, but I think the clubs approach to sign fringe first graders desperate for an opportunity is the right one. The club seems to have made a habit of signing hard workers (Hosking, Smithies etc) and I am confident this will pay off. So while there are risks, I don't accept that we are on the decline, far from it. I think the next 5 years could be the start of something very special

So..we have a 5yr plan ?

[Andymachine]

I think our players can be a bit overrated around here. One of these 'promising juniors' who's being spruiked as a big achievement for us isn't even signed, another hasn't played first grade and the last looks promising but all he's doing is running and tackling right now and we need a bit more from a half. Where they are in 5 years is anyone's guess but we've had enough Australian schoolboy halves come through the club who have turned out to be nothing that I'm not getting excited just yet. What they are right now is promising rookies who we've [possibly] grossly overpaid in order to get here and I hope it works out but it's far from fait accompli.

As for this immense middle rotation, I feel like our middles are overhype central on the Greenhouse. If they are "immense" then they wouldn't have been rolled by Newtown last week. We have 1 star prop who would walk into any other team in the comp but beyond Tapine it gets a lot more scratchy. Smithies is a tackle bot who I really hope can grow as a player but a superstar he is not. Papa has good footy in him but he's not the player he was 2-3 seasons ago. Hors made origin because of a number of injuries. He's a good player when he's on, but really only a fringe origin player and he won't make it this year. As we've just seen, right now he needs to be much better. Then we've got Guler and Saulo who basically never break 100m and consistently lose any momentum that Papa and Tapine gain. Ata is good but hasn't been given enough minutes to really show what he's got. I like him, but I do think a lot of posters overhype him. Then finally there's Mooney who we can't even include in this immense middle rotation because he never gets to be a part of it.

To FROG's question above, I think the club should have signed better, more experienced players the last couple of years. If we lose a $900k Josh Hodgson contract, I'd hope that the club goes to market and brings in a good player. We got Danny Levi and just upgraded the rest of the squad. Meanwhile Api went to Tigers for $700k and Mahoney went to the Dogs for $650k that same year. We lose a $600k Jarrod Croker and a $1.1M Jack Wighton and recruited no one of note in the halves or outside backs. At least when George WIlliams left we got Fog and when Ricky dumped Leilua he brought in Scott (worked out terribly but right idea I guess). In recent years it feels like we don't even try to replace players and just pin a lot of hope on juniors working out several years later.

[Colk]

I disagree colk. You point to our lack of star power as an indication that our future is bleak, and dismiss the prospect that we have 3 of the most promising junior spine players in our roster as any sign we will improve. Presumably you think the club should have signed better, experienced players, but I think the clubs approach to sign fringe first graders desperate for an opportunity is the right one. The club seems to have made a habit of signing hard workers (Hosking, Smithies etc) and I am confident this will pay off. So while there are risks, I don't accept that we are on the decline, far from it. I think the next 5 years could be the start of something very special

I’m glad people disagree. That is what a forum or a debate is about. I hope that our strategy works but there is a fair degree of risk in that plan (possibly the highest risk highest reward plan that I can think of)

My concern isn’t about junior talent (for as long as I can remember we have had good junior talent) it is more about how we bring these players in and what is our expectations of these players. As I have said earlier every example that I can think of where a great player/s has been developed has come from having a senior player/s in a key position/s working with them and giving them the time to develop at their own speed. It is a fairly logical approach in any case: as an analogy you wouldn’t come straight out of school or university and walk into a senior management position.

I think without that seniority or leadership around them, it is really hard to see how they are going to develop properly. If they face challenges which they inevitably will, who are they turning to in this instance? So again it is less a question of talent (as there are a lot of juniors with talent and a lot of clubs with good junior talent) but more a case of how is it going to be applied. I would just back a club developing a junior with good senior players around them than one without that. That might be negative in your opinion but I think it is just more realistic.

On the star power then yeah that is a concern and rightly so. I think Timoko and Tapine are massive pluses (almost the best in their positions) but in saying that you have to think that not having (or many) match winners in your side is ipso facto a problem

[Roger Kenworthy]

I disagree colk. You point to our lack of star power as an indication that our future is bleak, and dismiss the prospect that we have 3 of the most promising junior spine players in our roster as any sign we will improve. Presumably you think the club should have signed better, experienced players, but I think the clubs approach to sign fringe first graders desperate for an opportunity is the right one. The club seems to have made a habit of signing hard workers (Hosking, Smithies etc) and I am confident this will pay off. So while there are risks, I don't accept that we are on the decline, far from it. I think the next 5 years could be the start of something very special

We are in a very similar position to where we were in 04/07 and 13 with a batch of high flying juniors. Even when we had success in 2016/19 it was much more lightning in a bottle seasons based on external recruits.

This isn't a high percentage path we're taking. It's just the best path for the time being IMO.

[Colk]

I think our players can be a bit overrated around here. One of these 'promising juniors' who's being spruiked as a big achievement for us isn't even signed, another hasn't played first grade and the last looks promising but all he's doing is running and tackling right now and we need a bit more from a half. Where they are in 5 years is anyone's guess but we've had enough Australian schoolboy halves come through the club who have turned out to be nothing that I'm not getting excited just yet. What they are right now is promising rookies who we've [possibly] grossly overpaid in order to get here and I hope it works out but it's far from fait accompli.

As for this immense middle rotation, I feel like our middles are overhype central on the Greenhouse. If they are "immense" then they wouldn't have been rolled by Newtown last week. We have 1 star prop who would walk into any other team in the comp but beyond Tapine it gets a lot more scratchy. Smithies is a tackle bot who I really hope can grow as a player but a superstar he is not. Papa has good footy in him but he's not the player he was 2-3 seasons ago. Hors made origin because of a number of injuries. He's a good player when he's on, but really only a fringe origin player and he won't make it this year. As we've just seen, right now he needs to be much better. Then we've got Guler and Saulo who basically never break 100m and consistently lose any momentum that Papa and Tapine gain. Ata is good but hasn't been given enough minutes to really show what he's got. I like him, but I do think a lot of posters overhype him. Then finally there's Mooney who we can't even include in this immense middle rotation because he never gets to be a part of it.

To FROG's question above, I think the club should have signed better, more experienced players the last couple of years. If we lose a $900k Josh Hodgson contract, I'd hope that the club goes to market and brings in a good player. We got Danny Levi and just upgraded the rest of the squad. Meanwhile Api went to Tigers for $700k and Mahoney went to the Dogs for $650k that same year. We lose a $600k Jarrod Croker and a $1.1M Jack Wighton and recruited no one of note in the halves or outside backs. At least when George WIlliams left we got Fog and when Ricky dumped Leilua he brought in Scott (worked out terribly but right idea I guess). In recent years it feels like we don't even try to replace players and just pin a lot of hope on juniors working out several years later.

100% agree.

a) It is common for every supporters to overrate their teams talent. I understand that completely but at least acknowledge that as a possibility which some people aren’t.
b) Exactly right on the junior development. You don’t even have to look that far and wide to realise that a lot of juniors just don’t make it. Sometimes it is completely unavoidable (injuries); sometimes they are just massively overhyped by desperate supporters (which we could be doing here) or they just pick the wrong club with the wrong environment and the wrong players.
c) On the squad we have very good players no doubt but every squad in the NRL has very good players. We don’t have a decent player in our spine at all (Fogarty is the closest), we are short a few backrowers, we are hoping that really another one or two Timokos come through for our backline to be very good/elite and we are also hoping that another middle or two develops to replace Papa and help Tapine. There are a fair few holes in our squad if we are being honest.
d) Exactly where has this money gone? Also, you have touched on another point - most squads have got better. Dogs and Tigers for example were a lot further down in the mire 12-24 months ago and they will improve further. You just simply need to buy first grade players sometimes

[President Clinton]

I think our players can be a bit overrated around here. One of these 'promising juniors' who's being spruiked as a big achievement for us isn't even signed, another hasn't played first grade and the last looks promising but all he's doing is running and tackling right now and we need a bit more from a half. Where they are in 5 years is anyone's guess but we've had enough Australian schoolboy halves come through the club who have turned out to be nothing that I'm not getting excited just yet. What they are right now is promising rookies who we've [possibly] grossly overpaid in order to get here and I hope it works out but it's far from fait accompli.

As for this immense middle rotation, I feel like our middles are overhype central on the Greenhouse. If they are "immense" then they wouldn't have been rolled by Newtown last week. We have 1 star prop who would walk into any other team in the comp but beyond Tapine it gets a lot more scratchy. Smithies is a tackle bot who I really hope can grow as a player but a superstar he is not. Papa has good footy in him but he's not the player he was 2-3 seasons ago. Hors made origin because of a number of injuries. He's a good player when he's on, but really only a fringe origin player and he won't make it this year. As we've just seen, right now he needs to be much better. Then we've got Guler and Saulo who basically never break 100m and consistently lose any momentum that Papa and Tapine gain. Ata is good but hasn't been given enough minutes to really show what he's got. I like him, but I do think a lot of posters overhype him. Then finally there's Mooney who we can't even include in this immense middle rotation because he never gets to be a part of it.

To FROG's question above, I think the club should have signed better, more experienced players the last couple of years. If we lose a $900k Josh Hodgson contract, I'd hope that the club goes to market and brings in a good player. We got Danny Levi and just upgraded the rest of the squad. Meanwhile Api went to Tigers for $700k and Mahoney went to the Dogs for $650k that same year. We lose a $600k Jarrod Croker and a $1.1M Jack Wighton and recruited no one of note in the halves or outside backs. At least when George WIlliams left we got Fog and when Ricky dumped Leilua he brought in Scott (worked out terribly but right idea I guess). In recent years it feels like we don't even try to replace players and just pin a lot of hope on juniors working out several years later.

Mahoney Shouldn’t be mentioned in the same sentence as Api. Such an ordinary, overrated player. Small, slow and no creatively. Can’t stand him.

[Bluesbrother]

I don't remember a time in the club's history where we signed the number 1 schoolboy talent from a rival club?

The number 1 touted junior halfback coming through the grades seems to have signed with us.

Strange seems to have been less hyped but the signing has proven to be very astute. His performance in under 19s origin last year was one of the most emphatic I've seen. His performance in 1st grade this season as a 19 year old has been very, very promising. He has already demonstrated to be a safer and more mature player than Wighton. His strength and ball playing, kicking will only improve.

I think there is a huge difference to what has been done by the club in the past with these 3 players, and to your point Andy, that comes at a cost. You don't pry that type or talent away from their club, let alone the clutches of other, more desireable clubs, for peanuts. You pay for it. I'd suggest we're paying Stewart, Strange and Sanders a lot more than they were offered at other clubs.

Then, guys like Timoko, Mariota and the like - we need to factor in upgrades for these type of guys. Which we are doing.

I think the difference between now and years gone by is we have a plan that we are working towards and the people implementing that plan actually know what they are doing. The signing of Peter Mullholland marked a change for the Raiders - we are serious about attracting the best of the best young talent. If you look at the background of Joel Carbone, the club is clearly taking a very different approach than most and so far his tenure has been marked by the signing of players who have joined the club and improved and played their best football.

Coaches like Justin Giteau and Brock Sheppard have been in the development game for decades. Bringing them on board is another nod to the direction we are taking.

Under Ricky's tenure so far there has been 3 distinct phases.

1. Clean out immeadiately and bring in new players to change the fabric - similar to what the bulldogs are doing now. Improve the quality of the top 30 overall. 2014-2016.

2. Build using the best of the English contingent. 2017-2020.

3. Identify the best young talent in the game in key positions and sign them. Identify underrated players looking for an opportunity and sign them. Continue to scourer the ESL. 2020- present.

It's now clear our talent ID is as good as any. Timoko's signing alone should be lauded. He has become one of the most destructive backs in the NRL. Again, I cannot remember a time where the Raiders IDed a player like him and developed him to the point he is at now. Ruben Wiki comes to mind and that was 30 years ago.

There are no guarantees but it's our best approach of the 3 IMO. Our squad has tremendous upside and the age balance is where it needs to be moving into 2025 and beyond. The Panthers, and to a degree the Broncos have shown modern rugby league is very much a young man's game.

[BJ]

Chevy Stewart was ranked the number one schoolboy by the Daily Telegraph.

[Colk]

I disagree colk. You point to our lack of star power as an indication that our future is bleak, and dismiss the prospect that we have 3 of the most promising junior spine players in our roster as any sign we will improve. Presumably you think the club should have signed better, experienced players, but I think the clubs approach to sign fringe first graders desperate for an opportunity is the right one. The club seems to have made a habit of signing hard workers (Hosking, Smithies etc) and I am confident this will pay off. So while there are risks, I don't accept that we are on the decline, far from it. I think the next 5 years could be the start of something very special

We are in a very similar position to where we were in 04/07 and 13 with a batch of high flying juniors. Even when we had success in 2016/19 it was much more lightning in a bottle seasons based on external recruits.

This isn't a high percentage path we're taking. It's just the best path for the time being IMO.

But why is it either/or? Sometimes approaches have to be a little more nuanced. For example you just have to buy first grade ready players even if it is just for a transitioning period.

Like the clearest example is Penrith. Everybody quite rightly wants to be like Penrith. People forget though they didn’t just buy every 18 year old or put a bunch of teenagers in first grade all at once. They bought a massive amount of players between say 2015-2020 and a lot of these blokes weren’t ‘stars’. A lot of them were just dependable players who could do a job until your juniors are ready to take over although they did buy some good ones. Heck Luai and Edwards were in and out of first grade as an example.

There was a clear long term plan there. A lot of supporters seem to be of the opinion here that because some uncapped player/s have talent then the only way it can work is by putting them all in at the same time. A lot of kids will not be ready to play first grade immediately.