Rickmando wrote: ↑May 31, 2022, 10:09 pm
Dumb luck? Or just after lighting so much money on fire with the Croker and Whitehead deals, the NRL has mandated that Rick and the boys stop paying plodders and he doesn’t like it??
(Big collective sigh of relief in general though)
What’s Croker got to do with this? He’s a back and Elliot is a forward so you would assume the money comes from a different section of our cap. The correlation of Elliot not signing and Crokers wage is zero. Have a think about it
I don’t think you understand how the salary cap works chief. It’s not position-specific, it’s an overall number (that we have filled up with bludger contracts like Croker’s and therefore don’t have money to splash on other bludger contracts like Adam Elliott’s would-be one)
So yeah, Croker getting 700K a year to do bugger all would have a fair bit to do with this, I’d have thought. Why are you making me mansplain this?
You know that basically all teams sub divide the cap into play makers, forwards and backs right? But carry on with your wild assumptions about crokers wage
Botman wrote:It's **** great... i've felt old, tired and washed since about 1 month into my first kid
But Finchy, the world is at our young feet, brother
Billy however will be off to bed soon, and he's got some posting to do at BroncosHQ, it's a school night afterall.
Don't be so harsh on poor Billy. While the rest of us were at seiffert oval enjoying watching our team go from the struggling newbies to genuine contenders, poor Billy was collecting cans for pocket money. Fast forward 30 years and poor Billy is still out at seiffert oval every home game, searching for cans, while the rest of us are at Bruce. He'll get enough for that billy-cart any week now.
-PJ- wrote: ↑June 1, 2022, 2:48 pm
I’m hearing $550k per year for 3 years.
That must be Barnetts $$$.
Either way if that figure is accurate…LOL@KNIGHTS
Damn. The poor bullied guy
You said it friend, that why we tried to support our man in green - albeit futile against a relentless campaign - however its a splendid end to the sorry saga , with our man coming out on top of the money where he belongs!
$550,000 a year more than most of you are ever going to see - but remember one thing friends- we will always have one another!
Botman wrote:It's **** great... i've felt old, tired and washed since about 1 month into my first kid
But Finchy, the world is at our young feet, brother
Billy however will be off to bed soon, and he's got some posting to do at BroncosHQ, it's a school night afterall.
In my head cannon you will forever be a teenager living in penrith with a potty mouth.
Botman wrote:It's **** great... i've felt old, tired and washed since about 1 month into my first kid
But Finchy, the world is at our young feet, brother
Billy however will be off to bed soon, and he's got some posting to do at BroncosHQ, it's a school night afterall.
In my head cannon you will forever be a teenager living in penrith with a potty mouth.
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The potty mouth still exists... once the kids are in bed
that fibro shack i housed half a dozen RA guys in back in my late teens (cant specifically recall if you were there) is HOPEFULLY long gone
Botman wrote:It's **** great... i've felt old, tired and washed since about 1 month into my first kid
But Finchy, the world is at our young feet, brother
Billy however will be off to bed soon, and he's got some posting to do at BroncosHQ, it's a school night afterall.
Don't be so harsh on poor Billy. While the rest of us were at seiffert oval enjoying watching our team go from the struggling newbies to genuine contenders, poor Billy was collecting cans for pocket money. Fast forward 30 years and poor Billy is still out at seiffert oval every home game, searching for cans, while the rest of us are at Bruce. He'll get enough for that billy-cart any week now.
Botman wrote: ↑May 31, 2022, 10:07 pm
It feels very much like dumb luck that we didnt land him for massive overs.
I can’t stress enough how relieved I am that we didn’t re-sign him.
As Ricky’s ego project, he was always going to chew valuable game time from better players and that is painful to watch.
Very much had a Curtis Scott feel to it.
In saying that, at least Elliott has started to perform at a first grade level.
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I had a go at you before re Savage, so I will give credit where it's due... I like this theory of yours about Ricky having project players. It's a good point
I agree with Bot. Elliott has shown that he’s actually a pretty good player. A bit one dimensional but runs a good line, hits the line at speed for a quick ptb, and defensively strong. Great for impact off the bench, similar to Sutton. But these are the guys you want between minimum wage and maybe 350k. Anything more is overs and wasted cap space. If you’re forking out over half a mill per season for a backrower you need rep quality. Ryan Matterson, Isaah Yeo, Isaiah Papalii are probably on (or less than) 500k.
Finchy wrote: ↑June 5, 2022, 6:34 pm
I agree with Bot. Elliott has shown that he’s actually a pretty good player. A bit one dimensional but runs a good line, hits the line at speed for a quick ptb, and defensively strong. Great for impact off the bench, similar to Sutton. But these are the guys you want between minimum wage and maybe 350k. Anything more is overs and wasted cap space. If you’re forking out over half a mill per season for a backrower you need rep quality. Ryan Matterson, Isaah Yeo, Isaiah Papalii are probably on (or less than) 500k.
Probably right. There's guys like Crichton and Frizzel on 650k. Genuine rep players. You can't put Elliot up there. Capewell is on about 450k from what i heard. That seems more like the Elliot ballpark.
Today he played well, about as good as I've ever seen him play. If it came down to a cap decision though I'd be paying Young 450-500k if I had to and letting Elliot go for example. When they are both going well one is still clearly more influential than the other. Ceilings and all that.
Elliot is more mobile than I thought though. Might be a good lock in him after all.
Funny world. He’s a top 5 performer for us. Sad loss in retrospect but not worth what the knights are paying, so good luck to him and please continue to put in 100% for us whilst you’re here
bonehead wrote: ↑June 5, 2022, 7:57 pm
still makes dumb mistakes, 1st chooks try he overchases, gets stepped and gives up.
if he catches the ball later he scores 2 easy tries.
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I saw Savage coping some flack for that, and reasonably so, given his contribution which wasnt good... but i dont think i would single out any player on that, i counted about 7 blokes (Tapine, Elliott, Frawley, Kris, Young/Sutton? Both? Cotric and Savage) who had a shot to do something on that play and came up with poor efforts, to single out any single 1 of them seems harsh
Literally over half the team had a shot
Was never going to stay with us as long as his Mrs was in Newy
The spiral of silence refers to the idea that when people fail to speak, the price of speaking rises. As the price to speak rises, still fewer speak out, which further causes the price to rise, so that fewer people yet will speak out, until a whole culture or nation is silenced. This is what happened in Germany.
If you do not speak, you are not being neutral, but are contributing to the success of the thing you refuse to name and condemn.
Elliot's been playing good but I feel he is only on that money of a way of getting extra cash to Boyle who they can't pay what she deserves otherwise as the NRLW cap is so low. Good on them for cashing in as they should be able to. Raiders should have pushed harder for an NRLW team
The Raiders have applied to be admitted to the 2023 NRLW, and it looks like they will be. The idea we should be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment is downright ridiculous. They should be kept well apart. The Knights will find out why linking them is a bad idea.
greeneyed wrote:The Raiders have applied to be admitted to the 2023 NRLW, and it looks like they will be. The idea we should be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment is downright ridiculous. They should be kept well apart. The Knights will find out why linking them is a bad idea.
Can't say I agree with this. Part of a pitch to get any player to relocate to the city is what the club can do for their partner and/or family, if they have one.
To that extent, if a player has a partner with a particular career, I don't see why the club wouldn't consider that when negotiating a contract.
Not saying that we should have done anything different with Elliott, or that the club should have offered him more money, but that the club will always look at the bigger picture when negotiating with any player, but I take your point that the club shouldn't sign someone to the NRL squad just to get a good NRLW player on the books.
I'm with GE all the way here. To be blunt and maybe not PC, NRLW holds about 5% of the importance of the NRL at the current point in time (if that). Would make someone the CEO of McDonalds because you're worried about losing their partner - who is your best cashier? The importance of these two roster spots are at opposite ends of the spectrum.
If the Knights are using the NRL to prop up their NRLW squad then you have some solid reasoning on why they are the Knights.
greeneyed wrote: ↑June 6, 2022, 1:06 am
The Raiders have applied to be admitted to the 2023 NRLW, and it looks like they will be. The idea we should be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment is downright ridiculous. They should be kept well apart. The Knights will find out why linking them is a bad idea.
TBF i dont think anyone is saying we SHOULD be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment... i think we all agree that SHOULDNT happen, at least that's my position on it... but i do think in the case of Elliott and the interest from the Raiders and Knights, it was a factor. How much of a factor? 1%, 5%, 50%?
Who knows, but i feel pretty confident in saying when these clubs were fighting over Adam Elliott, Millie Boyle's potential signature was A factor that was considered.
greeneyed wrote: ↑June 6, 2022, 1:06 am
The Raiders have applied to be admitted to the 2023 NRLW, and it looks like they will be. The idea we should be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment is downright ridiculous. They should be kept well apart. The Knights will find out why linking them is a bad idea.
TBF i dont think anyone is saying we SHOULD be taking decision on recruitment and retention in our NRL team on the basis of NRLW recruitment... i think we all agree that SHOULDNT happen, at least that's my position on it... but i do think in the case of Elliott and the interest from the Raiders and Knights, it was a factor. How much of a factor? 1%, 5%, 50%?
Who knows, but i feel pretty confident in saying when these clubs were fighting over Adam Elliott, Millie Boyle's potential signature was A factor that was considered.
This. I'm sure it will be a factor in players decisions if they are in a situation like this in the future too so having an NRLW team is still a factor in attracting players to the club and the area.
Roger Kenworthy wrote:That's essentially saying our club is run incompetently. We already know the Knights are.
No way a club like the Roosters or Eels are making personnel decisions based on NRLW.
Weird that you used the eels, one of the most incompetently run clubs with multiple board dramas, as well as a massive salary cap breach in recent times as an example of club that's run well. Roosters however, fair enough.
Roger Kenworthy wrote:That's essentially saying our club is run incompetently. We already know the Knights are.
No way a club like the Roosters or Eels are making personnel decisions based on NRLW.
Weird that you used the eels, one of the most incompetently run clubs with multiple board dramas, as well as a massive salary cap breach in recent times as an example of club that's run well. Roosters however, fair enough.
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Yeah I was thinking more roster management. Fair point on a broader scale they have their basketcase moments
Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 6, 2022, 3:37 pm
That's essentially saying our club is run incompetently.
Since the halcyon days of the Rleague debate page
Scratch that, it makes them grossly incompetent.
Your first season as a raiders fan, m8?
I would say "gross incompetence" might be a fair summary of most of our last 20 years... you said "we already know the Knights are." and i say why do you think we're any better?
We're doing fine financially, and we're not likely to go under any time soon. But our football operations have been a **** show for a very long time. Seasonal situations that fell in our favour paper over the cracks, but it is what it is.
Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 6, 2022, 3:37 pm
That's essentially saying our club is run incompetently.
Since the halcyon days of the Rleague debate page
Scratch that, it makes them grossly incompetent.
Your first season as a raiders fan, m8?
I would say "gross incompetence" might be a fair summary of most of our last 20 years... you said "we already know the Knights are." and i say why do you think we're any better?
We're doing fine financially, and we're not likely to go under any time soon. But our football operations have been a **** show for a very long time. Seasonal situations that fell in our favour paper over the cracks, but it is what it is.
My word a lot of Raiders fans are delusional.
Have said before that we can’t look down our noses at anyone else in this league.
We are not the envy of any other club given the way our football club is run.
Mired in mediocrity, one of the longest premiership droughts going. And no real optimism for breaking it with all these boneheaded moves and a coach whose philosophy is stuck in the 1990’s.
Call me a “nego” all you like - but the above is indisputable. A few victories shouldn’t paper over all the glaring cracks in the way our footy club is run, but it predictably has. You can set your watch to it!
I really wish we demanded more as a supporter base, we have so much potential as a one-team town (and one time powerhouse) but we squander it with our old school small market mentality
Roger Kenworthy wrote: ↑June 6, 2022, 3:37 pm
That's essentially saying our club is run incompetently.
Since the halcyon days of the Rleague debate page
Scratch that, it makes them grossly incompetent.
Your first season as a raiders fan, m8?
I would say "gross incompetence" might be a fair summary of most of our last 20 years... you said "we already know the Knights are." and i say why do you think we're any better?
We're doing fine financially, and we're not likely to go under any time soon. But our football operations have been a **** show for a very long time. Seasonal situations that fell in our favour paper over the cracks, but it is what it is.
My word a lot of Raiders fans are delusional.
Have said before that we can’t look down our noses at anyone else in this league.
We are not the envy of any other club given the way our football club is run.
Mired in mediocrity, one of the longest premiership droughts going. And no real optimism for breaking it with all these boneheaded moves and a coach whose philosophy is stuck in the 1990’s.
Call me a “nego” all you like - but the above is indisputable. A few victories shouldn’t paper over all the glaring cracks in the way our footy club is run, but it predictably has. You can set your watch to it!
I really wish we demanded more as a supporter base, we have so much potential as a one-team town (and one time powerhouse) but we squander it with our old school small market mentality
We're comfortably in the middle of the pack over the last 5 years, more likely in the top 6 clubs based on onfield and offfield results. The NRL is full of basketcase clubs - we should absolutely aspire to look down our noses at the Dogs Warriors Knights Tigers Titans (and we can IMO). Much the same as the Roosters, Panthers and Storm look down us.
If we start paying NRL players to top up their wives or partners playing contracts then we'll be joining those at the foot of the table. That's one step beyond the underperformance of our head office though.
Your first season as a raiders fan, m8?
I would say "gross incompetence" might be a fair summary of most of our last 20 years... you said "we already know the Knights are." and i say why do you think we're any better?
We're doing fine financially, and we're not likely to go under any time soon. But our football operations have been a **** show for a very long time. Seasonal situations that fell in our favour paper over the cracks, but it is what it is.
My word a lot of Raiders fans are delusional.
Have said before that we can’t look down our noses at anyone else in this league.
We are not the envy of any other club given the way our football club is run.
Mired in mediocrity, one of the longest premiership droughts going. And no real optimism for breaking it with all these boneheaded moves and a coach whose philosophy is stuck in the 1990’s.
Call me a “nego” all you like - but the above is indisputable. A few victories shouldn’t paper over all the glaring cracks in the way our footy club is run, but it predictably has. You can set your watch to it!
I really wish we demanded more as a supporter base, we have so much potential as a one-team town (and one time powerhouse) but we squander it with our old school small market mentality
We're comfortably in the middle of the pack over the last 5 years, more likely in the top 6 clubs based on onfield and offfield results. The NRL is full of basketcase clubs - we should absolutely aspire to look down our noses at the Dogs Warriors Knights Tigers Titans (and we can IMO). Much the same as the Roosters, Panthers and Storm look down us.
If we start paying NRL players to top up their wives or partners playing contracts then we'll be joining those at the foot of the table. That's one step beyond the underperformance of our head office though.
We don’t have systems and processes much better than any of those clubs you name. On or off field.
We absolutely were going to do what you describe there, it’s just the Knights saved our bacon by coming in with more $$$’s. Can our strategy really just be hoping there are 15 clubs more incompetent than we are? We won’t get so lucky next time.
But you said it yourself - “comfortably middle of the pack”. I can’t see anything we are doing that indicates we’re ever aiming any higher than that. The last proactive move was the initial recruitment of Englishmen in the middle of last decade.
Let’s face it, we have a board that can’t expand their sights and scope beyond the 2620 postcode and a coach that seems stubbornly incapable of keeping up with progress (let alone innovation). We sit 11th on the table, playing for the most part a terrible brand of football to get there. I know I’m glass half empty, but I’ll happily listen to the glass half full case if anyone can muster one??
Your first season as a raiders fan, m8?
I would say "gross incompetence" might be a fair summary of most of our last 20 years... you said "we already know the Knights are." and i say why do you think we're any better?
We're doing fine financially, and we're not likely to go under any time soon. But our football operations have been a **** show for a very long time. Seasonal situations that fell in our favour paper over the cracks, but it is what it is.
My word a lot of Raiders fans are delusional.
Have said before that we can’t look down our noses at anyone else in this league.
We are not the envy of any other club given the way our football club is run.
Mired in mediocrity, one of the longest premiership droughts going. And no real optimism for breaking it with all these boneheaded moves and a coach whose philosophy is stuck in the 1990’s.
Call me a “nego” all you like - but the above is indisputable. A few victories shouldn’t paper over all the glaring cracks in the way our footy club is run, but it predictably has. You can set your watch to it!
I really wish we demanded more as a supporter base, we have so much potential as a one-team town (and one time powerhouse) but we squander it with our old school small market mentality
We're comfortably in the middle of the pack over the last 5 years, more likely in the top 6 clubs based on onfield and offfield results. The NRL is full of basketcase clubs - we should absolutely aspire to look down our noses at the Dogs Warriors Knights Tigers Titans (and we can IMO). Much the same as the Roosters, Panthers and Storm look down us.
If we start paying NRL players to top up their wives or partners playing contracts then we'll be joining those at the foot of the table. That's one step beyond the underperformance of our head office though.
We don’t have systems and processes much better than any of those clubs you name. On or off field.
We absolutely were going to do what you describe there, it’s just the Knights saved our bacon by coming in with more $$$’s. Can our strategy really just be hoping there are 15 clubs more incompetent than we are? We won’t get so lucky next time.
But you said it yourself - “comfortably middle of the pack”. I can’t see anything we are doing that indicates we’re ever aiming any higher than that. The last proactive move was the initial recruitment of Englishmen in the middle of last decade.
Let’s face it, we have a board that can’t expand their sights and scope beyond the 2620 postcode and a coach that seems stubbornly incapable of keeping up with progress (let alone innovation). We sit 11th on the table, playing for the most part a terrible brand of football to get there. I know I’m glass half empty, but I’ll happily listen to the glass half full case if anyone can muster one??
Speaking truths like that will get you accused of being a Bronco’s supporter.
The acceptance and celebration of mediocrity always amazes me. You only have to look at some of the discussions around best ever Raiders teams and the number of current day players being seen as all time legends. It doesn’t match the reality of where we sit and what we have turned out.
But while a small fan base accepts it, the club will keep turning it out and around and around we go.
more than most of you are ever going to see - but remember one thing friends- we will always have one another!
