SURVIVOR POLL I: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

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Who should be voted out?

Sam Backo
32
7%
Gary Belcher
1
0%
Terry Campese
32
7%
Brad Clyde
3
1%
Gary Coyne
37
8%
Jarrod Croker
21
5%
Jason Croker
4
1%
Laurie Daley
3
1%
John Ferguson
3
1%
David Furner
5
1%
Josh Hodgson
13
3%
Peter Jackson
26
6%
Dean Lance
15
3%
Glenn Lazarus
4
1%
John Lomax
30
6%
Mal Meninga
4
1%
Brett Mullins
8
2%
Ken Nagas
18
4%
Noa Nadruku
19
4%
Chris O'Sullivan
24
5%
Josh Papalii
4
1%
Quentin Pongia
25
5%
Jordan Rapana
8
2%
Clinton Schifcofske
25
5%
David Shillington
44
9%
Ricky Stuart
3
1%
Alan Tongue
36
8%
Steve Walters
2
0%
Jack Wighton
14
3%
Ruben Wiki
3
1%
 
Total votes: 466

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greeneyed
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SURVIVOR POLL I: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

SURVIVOR POLL I: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Back in 2007, the members of The Greenhouse voted on their top ten greatest ever Canberra Raiders. It was a survivor-style poll... and this was the top ten back then:

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Now, after 40 seasons of The Green Machine, we're going to vote again... and we'll see how the list might change. Will players from the modern era of the club be able to force their way in? The starting point will be the top 30 players selected in our poll for the 40 Year Dream Team.

In the first poll, we're going to vote 10 players off the island... and next week five. And then we will go one by one to determine the top ten best Raiders players, in order, of all time.

You have TEN votes in this poll. You may change your vote, but we'll declare the poll at this time next week. Remember, you are voting players OFF the island!
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greeneyed
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

That was tougher than I thought it might be.

Remember, this is a survivor style poll... you are voting players OFF the island.

Whoever voted Mal Meninga, Laurie Daley etc might like to try again.
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Northern Raider »

greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 11:32 am That was tougher than I thought it might be.

Remember, this is a survivor style poll... you are voting players OFF the island.

Whoever voted Mal Meninga, Laurie Daley etc might like to try again.
Haha, glad I read your post. I was about to boot out the guys who have statues outside the stadium. :lol:
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Northern Raider »

First round not that difficult to eliminate IMO. I went for guys who played for a variety of clubs e.g. Jacko, Schif, Lazo etc. Also guys who played less than 100 games for us like Lomax and Pongia. Still regard them all as Raiders legends.
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

Northern Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 12:12 pm
greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 11:32 am That was tougher than I thought it might be.

Remember, this is a survivor style poll... you are voting players OFF the island.

Whoever voted Mal Meninga, Laurie Daley etc might like to try again.
Haha, glad I read your post. I was about to boot out the guys who have statues outside the stadium. :lol:
At least a couple of people who've not read the instructions.
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Crash Ball »

Northern Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 12:26 pm First round not that difficult to eliminate IMO. I went for guys who played for a variety of clubs e.g. Jacko, Schif, Lazo etc. Also guys who played less than 100 games for us like Lomax and Pongia. Still regard them all as Raiders legends.
Pretty big call to dump Lazzo in the 1st Round.
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Re: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Northern Raider »

Crash Ball wrote: May 23, 2022, 12:49 pm
Northern Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 12:26 pm First round not that difficult to eliminate IMO. I went for guys who played for a variety of clubs e.g. Jacko, Schif, Lazo etc. Also guys who played less than 100 games for us like Lomax and Pongia. Still regard them all as Raiders legends.
Pretty big call to dump Lazzo in the 1st Round.
Yes but only 90 odd games for Raiders compared to 160+ for Broncos and Storm. We're eliminating Raiders legends so need some tough criteria to do that.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Hong Kong Raider »

This is very difficult as they have been great servants to our club and contributed in some form or another. They have given me heaps of joy growing up or recently. Even players that got a lot of votes like Shillo, Campese, Tongue and Coyne I have very fond memories of. Who can forget Coyne's four tries in the semi final v Manly in 1991, Tongue's efforts and leadership, Shillo's grit, and how Campese set us on fire in 2010

I actually liked the discussion in the match thread regarding Papa and him being one of our best five forwards ever.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Genuinely curious how you could rate Nagas over Noa? Is it just based on Noa's off field incident?

Noa has him covered for better peak and longer peak comfortably.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:26 pm
Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Genuinely curious how you could rate Nagas over Noa? Is it just based on Noa's off field incident?

Noa has him covered for better peak and longer peak comfortably.
I'd be lying if i said his off field incident hadn't irreparably damaged my thoughts and feelings around Noa.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Local junior who won two premierships with the Raiders.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by gerg »


Hong Kong Raider wrote:This is very difficult as they have been great servants to our club and contributed in some form or another. They have given me heaps of joy growing up or recently. Even players that got a lot of votes like Shillo, Campese, Tongue and Coyne I have very fond memories of. Who can forget Coyne's four tries in the semi final v Manly in 1991, Tongue's efforts and leadership, Shillo's grit, and how Campese set us on fire in 2010

I actually liked the discussion in the match thread regarding Papa and him being one of our best five forwards ever.
I think Papa is (almost) comfortably in our best five forwards. Walters and Clyde arguably better. I have a preference for Wiki in the centres but Papa is right up there with him if you're more inclined to think of Wiki as a forward in these discussions. Papa has been in the Qld side for about a decade, regularly selected for Australia. Third highest capped Raider. I think many forget how awesome he was on the edge.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:34 pm
Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Local junior who won two premierships with the Raiders.
Yes, i'm aware.
Thanks though... i guess?
Though i'm unsure what that has to do with my personal feelings and my votes... but ok!
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Ok, who are the jokers who couldn't find a place for Mal, an immortal, in even their top 10 Raiders?
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Lazo had 5 seasons with Raiders
6 with Broncs

so a fairly even split. And a couple with the Storm.

The fact he won multiple comps with all of them is why he seems to loom so large for all the teams. Incredible. I have him as a Raider, since he developed here and was here during the glory days.

There's no real criteria set for one's own ideas about who is a Raider and how Green you have to bleed though.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:49 pm Ok, who are the jokers who couldn't find a place for Mal, an immortal, in even their top 10 Raiders?
Their top 20 Raiders?
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:55 pm Lazo had 5 seasons with Raiders
6 with Broncs

so a fairly even split. And a couple with the Storm.

The fact he won multiple comps with all of them is why he seems to loom so large for all the teams. Incredible. I have him as a Raider, since he developed here and was here during the glory days.

There's no real criteria set for one's own ideas about who is a Raider and how Green you have to bleed though.
To put that into context for me though
I was born in 1987, which is Lazo's first year at the Raiders.
1992-93 when i was 5/6 are the first proper memories i have of being RL and Raiders fan, and he's at the Broncos by then and then of course his final years at the Storm. So i don't really have any "Lazarus Raiders" memories. The only time i saw him play for us was when i was bored at my Pop's house and threw on one of his old VHS
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 2:18 pm
BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:55 pm Lazo had 5 seasons with Raiders
6 with Broncs

so a fairly even split. And a couple with the Storm.

The fact he won multiple comps with all of them is why he seems to loom so large for all the teams. Incredible. I have him as a Raider, since he developed here and was here during the glory days.

There's no real criteria set for one's own ideas about who is a Raider and how Green you have to bleed though.
To put that into context for me though
I was born in 1987, which is Lazo's first year at the Raiders.
1992-93 when i was 5/6 are the first proper memories i have of being RL and Raiders fan, and he's at the Broncos by then and then of course his final years at the Storm. So i don't really have any "Lazarus Raiders" memories. The only time i saw him play for us was when i was bored at my Pop's house and threw on one of his old VHS
Ah right. I just assumed by your persona you were a crotchety old bastard :rant

Makes sense. I was lucky and my Dad took me along to the final game at Seiffert oval and then we had season tickets from '89 on through the glory years. I would have been an impressionable 10 year old in '89.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:32 pm
Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:26 pm
Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Genuinely curious how you could rate Nagas over Noa? Is it just based on Noa's off field incident?

Noa has him covered for better peak and longer peak comfortably.
I'd be lying if i said his off field incident hadn't irreparably damaged my thoughts and feelings around Noa.
Definitely fair enough :D
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

The aim is to make an assessment of the best 10 Raiders of all time though... hard to do if you haven't lived through 40 seasons, I guess, but you can look at records and old games etc. With Lazarus, he's very close to the top 10 Raiders of all time, if he's not in the top 10, for mine.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Hong Kong Raider »

I'm fortunate enough to see all those above play. Looking at the 2007 list, I can only see Papa breaking into the top 10, perhaps for David Furner. But even then it's difficult to replace someone who was the 1994 Clive Churchill medalist and has won a premiership. Both represented Australia with distinction. They are from different eras but I think Papa's longevity him. Papa was the best prop in the world in 2019 and 2020.

Also I don't know if this was mentioned in the match thread, but it was great to see Havili in the photos with Papa and Tapine, and then the Raiders' team. Respect.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 2:32 pm The aim is to make an assessment of the best 10 Raiders of all time though... hard to do if you haven't lived through 40 seasons, I guess, but you can look at records and old games etc. With Lazarus, he's very close to the top 10 Raiders of all time, if he's not in the top 10, for mine.
Good thing you have your votes and can use them as you see fit! :lol:
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by greeneyed »

Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 3:58 pm
greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 2:32 pm The aim is to make an assessment of the best 10 Raiders of all time though... hard to do if you haven't lived through 40 seasons, I guess, but you can look at records and old games etc. With Lazarus, he's very close to the top 10 Raiders of all time, if he's not in the top 10, for mine.
Good thing you have your votes and can use them as you see fit! :lol:
I was just trying help you with your feelings! Always just here to help.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Hong Kong Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 3:40 pm I'm fortunate enough to see all those above play. Looking at the 2007 list, I can only see Papa breaking into the top 10, perhaps for David Furner. But even then it's difficult to replace someone who was the 1994 Clive Churchill medalist and has won a premiership. Both represented Australia with distinction. They are from different eras but I think Papa's longevity him. Papa was the best prop in the world in 2019 and 2020.

Also I don't know if this was mentioned in the match thread, but it was great to see Havili in the photos with Papa and Tapine, and then the Raiders' team. Respect.
Wighton also a show. I can see Jason Croker or Chicka sliding out to make way for him.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

greeneyed wrote: May 23, 2022, 2:04 pm
BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:49 pm Ok, who are the jokers who couldn't find a place for Mal, an immortal, in even their top 10 Raiders?
Their top 20 Raiders?
Edged out by Ivan Henjak and David Boyle, sorry Mal.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Rickmando »

Surprised to see Adam Elliott miss out on a nomination tbh
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 4:54 pm
Hong Kong Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 3:40 pm I'm fortunate enough to see all those above play. Looking at the 2007 list, I can only see Papa breaking into the top 10, perhaps for David Furner. But even then it's difficult to replace someone who was the 1994 Clive Churchill medalist and has won a premiership. Both represented Australia with distinction. They are from different eras but I think Papa's longevity him. Papa was the best prop in the world in 2019 and 2020.

Also I don't know if this was mentioned in the match thread, but it was great to see Havili in the photos with Papa and Tapine, and then the Raiders' team. Respect.
Wighton also a show. I can see Jason Croker or Chicka sliding out to make way for him.
I love Jack, but he's also not quite even the best 5/8 we had. I LOVE that in Jack we have almost Laurie Daley mark II, But Daley shades him in every department except perhaps top line speed (Jack) and tackling power/technique (dead heat).

Chicka on the other hand, owns the left wing forever. Until we get another winger who can win GF's by jarring the ball out in defence, skipping umpteen tacklers, scoring crunch tries for fun etc etc. The yardstick would have to be, "does the crowd chant the wingers personal nicname as often as Raiders *** Raiders ***...?" and until the answer is yes, the answer remains Chicka.

Jason Croker... just about. He gets a run for his longevity and try records. He was an incredibly tough and brave player. Kind of the ultimate footy player who could just play any position and do it damn well. Including zippy winger in his early days or bone crunching lock/backrower later on. 300 games is a helluva thing. I could see Jack finishing his career over the top of Toots one day- but I'm having a hard time accepting he's there yet...
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Rickmando wrote: May 23, 2022, 5:17 pm Surprised to see Adam Elliott miss out on a nomination tbh
Just another example of the relentless bullying Big Ears Elliot cops on here.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Rickmando »

BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 5:26 pm
Rickmando wrote: May 23, 2022, 5:17 pm Surprised to see Adam Elliott miss out on a nomination tbh
Just another example of the relentless bullying Big Ears Elliot cops on here.
Waiting for him to go meta and talk about the Greenhouse in his next presser. Maybe a big reveal that he’s actually posting as joshjacksonshead?

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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 5:25 pm
Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 4:54 pm
Hong Kong Raider wrote: May 23, 2022, 3:40 pm I'm fortunate enough to see all those above play. Looking at the 2007 list, I can only see Papa breaking into the top 10, perhaps for David Furner. But even then it's difficult to replace someone who was the 1994 Clive Churchill medalist and has won a premiership. Both represented Australia with distinction. They are from different eras but I think Papa's longevity him. Papa was the best prop in the world in 2019 and 2020.

Also I don't know if this was mentioned in the match thread, but it was great to see Havili in the photos with Papa and Tapine, and then the Raiders' team. Respect.
Wighton also a show. I can see Jason Croker or Chicka sliding out to make way for him.
I love Jack, but he's also not quite even the best 5/8 we had. I LOVE that in Jack we have almost Laurie Daley mark II, But Daley shades him in every department except perhaps top line speed (Jack) and tackling power/technique (dead heat).

Chicka on the other hand, owns the left wing forever. Until we get another winger who can win GF's by jarring the ball out in defence, skipping umpteen tacklers, scoring crunch tries for fun etc etc. The yardstick would have to be, "does the crowd chant the wingers personal nicname as often as Raiders *** Raiders ***...?" and until the answer is yes, the answer remains Chicka.

Jason Croker... just about. He gets a run for his longevity and try records. He was an incredibly tough and brave player. Kind of the ultimate footy player who could just play any position and do it damn well. Including zippy winger in his early days or bone crunching lock/backrower later on. 300 games is a helluva thing. I could see Jack finishing his career over the top of Toots one day- but I'm having a hard time accepting he's there yet...
Yeah it's more recency bias that I see Wighton having a shot. He has the individual accolades from 2020-21.

Chicka obviously outstanding in his time here and deserves a spot on the back end of that list. Fit a lot into his 94 games.

There's potential some people only saw Croker from 04 onwards when his impact was starting to drop off. But he was an excellent performer from 93-00, and was still having a top drawer season as late as 2003.

On a different note as time goes by I'm really starting to think of Sticky as being our most important player. It's likely Fox drilling that narrative into me over the past few years :lol:
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

Wighton has a Dally M Medal and a Clive Churchill medal in his back pocket
He's got a pretty solid resume... We've got a lot of really excellent players though, but he'll be in the hunt come the top 15 imo

He wont be in the top 10, premiership winners and MAYBE Papalii will hold down those spots.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by The Nickman »

Botman wrote:
Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:26 pm
Botman wrote: May 23, 2022, 1:11 pm I went wth:

Terry Campese, Gary Coyne, Jarrod Croker, Peter Jackson, John Lomax, Noa Nadruku, Quentin Pongia, Clinton Schifcofske, David Shillington and Alan Tongue
They all seem pretty popular, Noa is the only one i selected who's got less than 5 votes off

To NR's point above, Lazo was a consideration here and i doubt he'll survive my next cut votes because i primarily see him as a Broncos/Storm player
Genuinely curious how you could rate Nagas over Noa? Is it just based on Noa's off field incident?

Noa has him covered for better peak and longer peak comfortably.
Oh Kent, I'd be lying if i said his off field incident hadn't irreparably damaged my thoughts and feelings around Noa.
Well... touché
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by BadnMean »

Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 23, 2022, 7:21 pm [
On a different note as time goes by I'm really starting to think of Sticky as being our most important player. It's likely Fox drilling that narrative into me over the past few years :lol:
Just on this part.

I don't think it's that exaggerated.

Sticky was clearly driving standards ala Bateman.

But he was also doing things Joey Johns is rhapsodised about but decades earlier, with a dead lug leather ball to boot. Be it kicking, passing etc.

Mal was most important, overall...perhaps...It looked almost unfair at times, what Mal could do. And it still would vs any team in the current era, should he play. Just as Ricky would make them unfold the 40/20 and 20/40 quick smart.

Hard to split the two, it would be hard to argue over either. I was a kid at the time. My old mans opinion was that Ricky was the key from 1990/1991 onwards. Pre that, then Mal was it. With either being #1/2 at either time. Just his opinion.

Halfbacks are trendier today so I can see the vibe- but Big Mal could influence a game from centre. Like you wouldn't believe unless you saw it.

Watch some old games- we see Big Mal kicking regularly from centre, for distance or close in. And nailing it.As good as Jack. Making yards like a prop/2nd rower- massive yards like Timoko upscaled to giant size. Doing the killer hits in defence ala Wighton but 20kg deadlier... I love Rick. I could accept the argument he's most influential. But Mal was ridiculously good- it'd need to be an amazingly well made argument. And define the parameters- on field surrounded by a champion team... or being the man to gather one around you, like a planet's orbit.
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Re: SURVIVOR POLL: Top ten greatest ever Raiders

Post by Botman »

I think our best 5 players are without question

Meninga, Stuart, Walters, Daley and Clyde.. and we can probably all quibble about the order of 2-5 (that's my personal order), but that's the 5 imo. And i think there is a pretty good drop off beyond them
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